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As Fred Reed said the Whitehouse/Pentagon views a Marine in front of the camera as a liability. My personal opinion? This entire article needs to be on the front page of every newspaper in the country.

A Young Marine Speaks Out

"A recent Marine Corps intelligence report that was leaked said that the war in the al-Anbar province is unwinnable. It said that there was nothing we could do to win the hearts and minds, or the military operations in that area. So I wonder, why are we still there? Democracy is not forced upon people at gunpoint. It's the result of forward thinking individuals who take the initiative and risks to give their fellow countrymen a better way of life."
================================================================================ "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." Arthur Schopenhauer - German philosopher (1788 - 1860)
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quote:
Originally posted by miamizsun:
As Fred Reed said the Whitehouse/Pentagon views a Marine in front of the camera as a liability. My personal opinion? This entire article needs to be on the front page of every newspaper in the country.

A Young Marine Speaks Out

This young marine is definitely one that the Bu****e administration would trot out to testify on troop morale or on the "successes" we are achieving in Iraq Nam. But His voice is, I suspect, one among many of our troops who can think for themselves and recognize reality! In Iraq, this country and its President picked about the worst possible venue for the attempted establishment of a "model democracy in the Middle East." The schismatic, divisive, sectarian, tribalistic and socio-religious character of that country is the WORST possible situation in which to attempt such a venture

"A recent Marine Corps intelligence report that was leaked said that the war in the al-Anbar province is unwinnable. It said that there was nothing we could do to win the hearts and minds, or the military operations in that area. So I wonder, why are we still there? Democracy is not forced upon people at gunpoint. It's the result of forward thinking individuals who take the initiative and risks to give their fellow countrymen a better way of life."
paslusher.. how can you call anyone a coward who has been there, seen that???? What have you seen? Where have you been? How do you know?

The Middle Easterners have been fighting for so many years it is unreal, they LIVE for it, they breath it, they teach it, THEY LOVE IT!!! Now that we are involved, well, that can of worms may not EVER be able to be closed.

I think that is what they were planning from the start, gives them a 'reason' to target the much loathed Americans. And like one of the Al Quida said on television (interperturs of course) is that if Bush had never been elected, none of this would have happened at all, because of the Oil Industrial Business ties.

I have no idea what goes on in their minds or why they think they can just kill people for no reason on a daily basis, but it sure sounds feasible that they find a way to bring us into it, they hate us just that much.

Can we ever leave? I personally dont think so, I think as soon as we do, even 20 years from now, they are going to be over here in droves... WAIT!!! They are already over here in droves........

No one who hasn't experienced any of what is going on over 'there' has the right to call anyone a coward if they don't agree with what they experience......
quote:
And like one of the Al Quida said on television (interperturs of course) is that if Bush had never been elected, none of this would have happened at all, because of the Oil Industrial Business ties.


What wouldn't have happened? The terrorists that want to either cut our throats or convert us and the entire world to Islam would be nice if we elected a Democrat?

This war has been brewing since before the Reagan administration. Here is a brief timeline from 79-88.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/target/etc/cron.html
"When I joined I took an oath. In that oath I swore to protect the Constitution of the United States. I didn't swear to build democracies in countries on the other side of the world under the guise of "national security." I didn't join the military to be part of an Orwellian ("1984") war machine that is in an obligatory war against whoever the state deems the enemy to be so that the populace can be controlled and riled up in a pro-nationalistic frenzy to support any new and oppressive law that will be the key to destroying the enemy."


Amen, brother!
And, I've NEVER rescinded that oath!
Actually, if I'm not mistaken, we can (and have, and do) get it done in eight weeks.

It's just that the law regulating the same (yes, there's regulating law) requires 12 weeks.

So, in-processing is a week or so, out-processing is a week, or so, and bada-boom, bada-bing... 12 weeks!

Brent?

What's the USC (United States Code) on that? I'm not sure I recall the chapter & verse.

It does say 12 weeks, I believe. But isn't training actually about 8 or so?
The only exceptions to the 12-week basic training (or equivalent training) law are "who have been credentialed in a medical profession or occupation and are serving in a health-care occupational specialty."

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbna...docid=Cite:+10USC671

From the U.S. Code Online via GPO Access
[wais.access.gpo.gov]
[Laws in effect as of January 20, 2004]
[Document not affected by Public Laws enacted between
January 20, 2004 and December 23, 2004]
[CITE: 10USC671]


TITLE 10--ARMED FORCES

Subtitle A--General Military Law

PART II--PERSONNEL

CHAPTER 39--ACTIVE DUTY

Sec. 671. Members not to be assigned outside United States
before completing training

(a) A member of the armed forces may not be assigned to active duty
on land outside the United States and its territories and possessions
until the member has completed the basic training requirements of the
armed force of which he is a member.
(b) In time of war or a national emergency declared by Congress or
the President, the period of required basic training (or its equivalent)
may not (except as provided in subsection (c)) be less than 12 weeks.
(c)(1) A period of basic training (or equivalent training) shorter
than 12 weeks may be established by the Secretary concerned for members
of the armed forces who have been credentialed in a medical profession
or occupation and are serving in a health-care occupational specialty,
as determined under regulations prescribed under paragraph (2). Any such
period shall be established under regulations prescribed under paragraph
(2) and may be established notwithstanding section 4(a) of the Military
Selective Service Act (50 U.S.C. App. 454(a)).
(2) The Secretary of Defense, and the Secretary of Homeland Security
with respect to the Coast Guard when it is not operating as a service in
the Navy, shall prescribe regulations for the purposes of paragraph (1).
The regulations prescribed by the Secretary of Defense shall apply
uniformly to the military departments.

(Aug. 10, 1956, ch. 1041, 70A Stat. 27; Pub. L. 94-106, title VIII,
Sec. 802(b), Oct. 7, 1975, 89 Stat. 537; Pub. L. 99-661, div. A, title
V, Sec. 501, Nov. 14, 1986, 100 Stat. 3863; Pub. L. 103-160, div. A,
title V, Sec. 511, Nov. 30, 1993, 107 Stat. 1648; Pub. L. 107-296, title
XVII, Sec. 1704(b)(1), Nov. 25, 2002, 116 Stat. 2314.)

Historical and Revision Notes
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revised section Source (U.S. Code) Source (Statutes at Large)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
671................................... 50 App.:454(a) (words between June 24, 1948, ch. 625, Sec. 4(a)
semicolon and proviso of 6th (words between semicolon and
par.). proviso of 6th par.); restated
June 19, 1951, ch. 144, Sec. 1(d)
(words between semicolon and
proviso of 6th par.), 65 Stat. 78.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The words ``four months of basic training or its equivalent'' are
substituted for the words ``the equivalent of at least four months of
basic training''. The words ``who is enlisted, inducted, appointed, or
ordered to active duty after the date of enactment of the 1951
Amendments to the Universal Military Training and Service Act [June 19,
1951]'' and ``at any installation located'' are omitted as surplusage.


Amendments

2002--Subsec. (c)(2). Pub. L. 107-296 substituted ``of Homeland
Security'' for ``of Transportation''.
1993--Subsec. (b). Pub. L. 103-160, Sec. 511(1), inserted ``(except
as provided in subsection (c))'' after ``may not''.
Subsec. (c). Pub. L. 103-160, Sec. 511(2), added subsec. (c).
1986--Pub. L. 99-661 amended section generally. Prior to amendment,
section read as follows: ``No member of an armed force may be assigned
to active duty on land outside the United States and its Territories and
possessions, until he has had twelve weeks of basic training or its
equivalent.''
1975--Pub. L. 94-106 reduced minimum period of basic training from
four months to twelve weeks.


Effective Date of 2002 Amendment

Amendment by Pub. L. 107-296 effective on the date of transfer of
the Coast Guard to the Department of Homeland Security, see section
1704(g) of Pub. L. 107-296, set out as a note under section 101 of this
title.


http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode10/usc_sec...0000671----000-.html

TITLE 10 > Subtitle A > PART II > CHAPTER 39 > § 671 Prev | Next

§ 671. Members not to be assigned outside United States before completing training

(a) A member of the armed forces may not be assigned to active duty on land outside the United States and its territories and possessions until the member has completed the basic training requirements of the armed force of which he is a member.
(b) In time of war or a national emergency declared by Congress or the President, the period of required basic training (or its equivalent) may not (except as provided in subsection (c)) be less than 12 weeks.
(c)
(1) A period of basic training (or equivalent training) shorter than 12 weeks may be established by the Secretary concerned for members of the armed forces who have been credentialed in a medical profession or occupation and are serving in a health-care occupational specialty, as determined under regulations prescribed under paragraph (2). Any such period shall be established under regulations prescribed under paragraph (2) and may be established notwithstanding section 4(a) of the Military Selective Service Act (50 App. U.S.C. 454 (a)).
(2) The Secretary of Defense, and the Secretary of Homeland Security with respect to the Coast Guard when it is not operating as a service in the Navy, shall prescribe regulations for the purposes of paragraph (1). The regulations prescribed by the Secretary of Defense shall apply uniformly to the military departments.
From what I understand, and I may be wrong here, basic training for each branch is the following:

US Marines: 12 weeks

US Army: 9 weeks

US Air Force: 6-7 weeks

US Navy: I am not sure, guessing 8-9 weeks

Each branch has specific requirements as directed by Title 10 and their training command. The US Army training command is Training and Doctrine Command (TRADOC). The CG of TRADOC is GEN William Wallace. Myself and 20+ other Majors had a discussion with him about 10 days ago. GEN Wallace, if you may or may not know, was the V Corps commander during OIF. He is the one who made the statement: "We didn't wargame it this way back in January" when we were starting to get "difficulties" as we drove north to Baghdad (they didn't wargame suicide bombers and the like from what I heard).

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