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quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
quote:
Originally posted by semiannualchick:
If such a billboard does go up, with this being the bible belt, I wonder how long it will take for the churches/Christians to demand that it come down? Big Grin


Vandalism is the more likely outcome. Stay tuned.

-----------------------------------
You might be right A.Rob, I just don't see it. It's only a billboard.

Inv
quote:
Originally posted by b50m:
They are all too busy out-Christianing each other to notice AR.

But I did get a good laugh out of this line from Bill.


quote:
So, to all of my Forum Friends who want to believe Dwight and his Mormon church -- I do believe a day will come when I will have to say, "I told you I don't trust a man who will not answer a question."


hah!
quote:
Originally posted by INVICTUS:
quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
quote:
Originally posted by semiannualchick:
If such a billboard does go up, with this being the bible belt, I wonder how long it will take for the churches/Christians to demand that it come down? Big Grin


Vandalism is the more likely outcome. Stay tuned.

-----------------------------------
You might be right A.Rob, I just don't see it. It's only a billboard.

Inv


I hope you're right. It would bode well for North Alabama as a whole.
quote:
Originally posted by Unobtanium:
better,

they are "preaching" to the atheists and agnostics who still go to church (i used to be one of those), not to all christians. it's a statement letting them know they are not alone and to go ahead and embrace that doubt.

you obviously do not believe that church is a scam despite the evidence to the contrary. the billboard is not for you.


So the crowd that is erecting those billboards is bottom feeding, it would seem. If their goal is to lure back into unabashed atheism those closet atheists who currently go to church, then what they are doing is trolling for the HYPOCRITES within the atheist fellowship.
I guess the only thing that bothers me about this is the declaration that
" YOU KNOW" they are all scams.
Who knows? Me? Everyone? Who is the target audience here. The atheist?
I understand the need for the atheists to come together, and I completely respect their right to advertise, just as a church advertises. BUT
the "you know" seems to be a tad predatory, as though they are luring those in doubt, or preying on uncertainties. Just my opinion, but I found the choice of wording a bit suspect.
quote:
Who knows? Me? Everyone? Who is the target audience here. The atheist?



vp, yes, the closet atheist is, indeed, the target. those are the people that "know" it's a scam but are afraid to embrace that bothersome fact out of fear of losing their community identity.

i was once one of those people who sat in church rolling my eyes at the silliness that i witnessed every wednesday and sunday. the problem is that i thought i was alone in my doubt. i had no one to reach out to.

this sign is for those people.
quote:
but it is clear to the closet atheist.


Yes, I suppose it is.
Just validation, I suppose of that person's doubts.
Everybody recruits, right, lol. Atheists included. Why not?
They are entitled to express their opinions.
However, it is presumptous to state that "YOU KNOW"....cuz they don't know what I know. Smiler Cheers
quote:
Sez Unob:
vp, yes, the closet atheist is, indeed, the target. those are the people that "know" it's a scam but are afraid to embrace that bothersome fact out of fear of losing their community identity.

i was once one of those people who sat in church rolling my eyes at the silliness that i witnessed every wednesday and sunday. the problem is that i thought i was alone in my doubt. i had no one to reach out to.

this sign is for those people.



I have thought about this.
I have no problem with the idea of free expression. I have no problem with the act of Atheist Organizations erecting the sign. No more than the various religious signs. Doesn't change a thing with my life.

Now, I look at this as "intent" and "perception".
Everyone calls this area the "Bible Belt"...
No one is ignorant to this statement.
The "intent" was to get a message to closet atheists. That is the target. Yet, I find it hard to beleive that the planners of the sign could overlook the "perception" it would generate amoung the non-atheists.
Surely, someone would not have overlooked this as antagonistic in it's wording.
My point being the word SCAM. That would be a direct confrontation to a believer.
I think doubters / un believers could be reached, and the wording could have been in a way that there was no doubt who was being reached out to.
In this instance, I would think it would make it harder for me, and maybe in some cases, an atheist, to "come out" to my family and friends. The idea here being the love I have for them, and vice versa.
I would rather tell them I had no belief in a god. That would be MY belief. We would have to work around that, attempting to reach an understanding, yet, I would never tell them they were being scammed...by THEIR belief.I do not know that for a fact. I would like to think we could still be family and friends. I would WANT us to be family. Telling them they were ignorant, and being "scammed" would no doubt destroy that.
It has been implied on this oranizations website, and by some here, that "confronting"
is prefered to "passive". The time for action.
Again, I could be wrong, but I believe the sign is geared more to confrontation, than reaching out.
But, then, I don't care.
I think it's shows religious hypocrisy at it's best. You never see Atheists complaining about religious signs posted up around their city. Those signs never make the news. Why should atheists signs be any different? You don't have to agree with it, just like I don't have to agree with religious signs.

I personally believe this is a great country founded by great secular founding fathers that saw first hand the damage religion can do in government, and they chose to take a neutral route and give everyone the right to believe or not believe in what they wanted to, and to keep religion out of government, and government out of religion. Very brilliant men that started a revolution that continues on till this day.

So the next time you see a sign like this, think about how atheists and agnostics feel when they see religious signs. We don't agree with them, but we don't b1tch, moan, and complain about someone using their right to freedom of speech to express their beliefs.
quote:
Originally posted by _Joy_:
I got the message.

All religions are scams...that's their message.

Also, Atheists apparently tell the truth. I'd have to see that to believe it. Big Grin


THAT IS NOT THE MESSAGE!

the sign specifically targets atheists who are sitting in the pews!

i would vehemently disagree that all religions are a scam. they most certainly are not,. a scam requires that the perpetrator know he is taking money from gullible people. yes, there is certainly a lot of that going on in most religions by i believe most preachers and church leaders do not know they are swindling their followers.

but for the atheist sitting in the pew who is afraid of letting go of his church community, the billboard speaks volumes. it is simply urging them to embrace that doubt and to stop being a hypocrite,,, and that there are others "out there" who feel the same.

that said, i do not necessarily agree with this tactic taken by the atheist organization. i am critical of it because it can be interpreted too many ways. an advertising message should be clear and concise.
quote:
[uno]i do not necessarily agree with this tactic taken by the atheist organization. i am critical of it because it can be interpreted too many ways. an advertising message should be clear and concise

Harrrrrrrumph [cough cough] if I may jump in here,

Uno if you would just step back for a moment; obviously this group are the same fringe as the Westbro [sp] group.

I wouldn’t be too critical; they probably did the best they could do.
Last edited by buffalo
quote:
yeah, i mostly agree with you there. "know" is not a word to be used lightly by a atheist organization.



Maybe just something along the lines of "If you know you don't believe- you're not alone" or whatever. Don't you know the billboard owners love it, because when an atheist billboard goes up the churches scramble to toss up another one of theirs.
quote:
Originally posted by Unobtanium:
quote:
Originally posted by _Joy_:
I got the message.

All religions are scams...that's their message.

Also, Atheists apparently tell the truth. I'd have to see that to believe it. Big Grin


THAT IS NOT THE MESSAGE!

the sign specifically targets atheists who are sitting in the pews!

i would vehemently disagree that all religions are a scam. they most certainly are not,. a scam requires that the perpetrator know he is taking money from gullible people. yes, there is certainly a lot of that going on in most religions by i believe most preachers and church leaders do not know they are swindling their followers.

but for the atheist sitting in the pew who is afraid of letting go of his church community, the billboard speaks volumes. it is simply urging them to embrace that doubt and to stop being a hypocrite,,, and that there are others "out there" who feel the same.

that said, i do not necessarily agree with this tactic taken by the atheist organization. i am critical of it because it can be interpreted too many ways. an advertising message should be clear and concise.


Sorry. That's what it looks like to me. Various types of religious buildings pictured and "You KNOW they're all SCAMS" beside it. There is no clarification like "Dear Closet Atheists" in order to deduce that the message is to them only. Smiler
"You know they're all scams" All atheist believe that to be true.
I never knew why a thesaurus thumper cared anyway? Or is the
reason atheists don't want believers talking religion? I have never
told a atheist they were going to hell, and the only person I told
they were going to heaven is myself. But we all know that be right.
This is getting boring, I going to start another fight, which will
be my first.

Kvn
Joy,
Think about it. The message doesn't really makes sense unless it's aimed at closeted atheists who still go to church/synagoge/mosque/temple/etc. Telling people who don't really think it's a scam, that it's a scam is pretty fruitless. If you read the article from the Huntsville Times that I linked, it spells out the message of the billboard several times, including in the very first sentence, "Alert to mission-supporting, God-fearing, neighbor-helping Christians: You are not the target of the billboard about to go up across from Joe Davis Stadium." Also, "The American Atheists have rented the billboard visible from the northbound lanes of Memorial Parkway for the second in a national series of "You Know" messages meant to attract attention, stir conversation, and encourage "closeted" atheists to be more open about their unbelief." And, "We know we're going to make a lot of people mad - we understand that," Scott said. "But our target is not the Christians, but all the atheists and agnostics still in the closet who are still pretending, still playing the game, still putting up a facade." Clearly though, we know that American Atheists has put in motion a provocative campaign that is designed to get attention. "Thanks to the Catholic League, our message reached hundreds of people," Scott said. "We received e-mails from people saying, 'Thank you. I thought I was the only one.' We sent the League a thank-you letter." If it was a completely uncontroversial and safe message, it wouldn't be good advertising because we and everybody else that knows about it wouldn't be talking about it.
Out here in Gomorrah-on-the-Pacific, one can still see regular billboards that say stuff like "Only Jesus Saves From Hell!" and such. Usually some Rev. Dr. Maniac offers to save you and damm you if you don't come to HIS church. I don't have to tell you how often you see them in Alabama.

We nonreligious who make up about 15% (and growing) of the American population get to have a billboard now and then.

Would y'all have preferred another message such as "Good without god"?

nsns
quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
I don't get upset at christian billboards saying "god is the way" etc. And in that case I'd suspect they are trying to convince non-believers or "backsliders."


Privileged majorities often have a really hard time seeing things on the flip-side.


Isn't that the point of the billboard? Wink

nsns
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Isn't that the point of the billboard?

"are" in italics. Or tongue in cheek. Or wink wink. Point being that atheists are not recruiting. Who would even think that. What the heck would we do with them after we recruited them?



LOL!

OK, we gotcha! You're not an atheist! Do as I say!

"(!#* me".

Oh, dear. I guess you really ARE an atheist.


nsns

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