BILL GRAY DOESN’T WANT YOU TO READ THIS:

Hi all,

For once, Al is correct. I do not want to see ANYONE involved in Al's New Age Religion nor his New Age bible -- the Urantia Book. Why? Because, before I was a Christian believer, I was involved for years in the New Age and psychic community and world. I know the inherent dangers lurking there. I have personally experienced and seen them myself.

So, yes, I will warn folks to walk a wide path around the Urantia Book, all New Age religion, and all psychic involvement.

If you knew someone who was being lured into using drugs; would you not warn them against it? If you see someone shooting up heroin; will you not try to help them?

By the same token, when we see someone attempting to lure unsuspecting folks into the arms of New Age religion and its psychic priests and priestesses -- we warn them to walk away. I am warning folks to stay away from Al's New Age bible, the Urantia Book -- and all his New Age trappings.

By the way, Al -- you do not need to scream (all caps) to get our attention. If what you write is worthwhile; we will read it -- without your ALL CAPS TITLES! In a way, this method kind of reminds me of the way New Age devotees seek to lure folks into their dens of foolishness.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

Checked the link. That is a lot to read. I read a little. Isn't really for me. Thankfully its a free country and we cannot worry about any point-of-view forced down us. Bill is simply living his conviction and I have to give him credit for that. I guess you are too.

Al all I can say is Satan is good, actually he's brilliant, he has devised as many plans, tactics, books, teachings to mislead as many people as possible.

The funny thing about God is He gives us all a free choice to choose Him or someone else. Jesus called the Jewish leaders (at that time) sons of the devil and they were. Muslims do not give people freedom they only take freedoms, which is not a characteristic of God so this tells me they are worshiping a false god. The anti-Christ will be the same way, you will worship him and only him and those who disagree will be killed.

God's character has been, will be, and forever will be about freedom. That is the whole point of shedding His blood for us. Think about it, who else has ever shed their blood for you! Who else gives you freedom over death?

It won't hurt to mind all your respective deities about Jimmeh Carter.

quote:

Originally posted by ngt2293:
God's character has been, will be, and forever will be about freedom. That is the whole point of shedding His blood for us. Think about it, who else has ever shed their blood for you! Who else gives you freedom over death?

You have insulted the thousands of brave men and women who truly have “shed their blood for” us. You apparently do not realize it, but men and women have shed their blood fighting wars on our behalf--wars that brought us and maintained our freedom..

God’s barbaric deed which shed Christ’s blood had nothing to do with humankind’s freedom. How did the crucifixion bring us freedom? The creators of the Christ myth realized that the crucifixion did nothing to improve humankind. Man was no more free after the crucifixion than before the alleged event. The solution was to concoct a story about a paradise that existed for believers after a miserable life on earth. Hence, the story goes that it does not matter that Christ did nothing to improve humanity because believers will end up in paradise after a brief stint on earth. Of course, there is not one shred of evidence that a paradise exists. There is overwhelming evidence that the crucifixion story has shackled men’s/women’s minds with superstition. While physical slavery in the Christian world has finally vanished after 1800 years, intellectual slavery is very much with us.

quote:

God's character has been, will be, and forever will be about freedom. That is the whole point of shedding His blood for us. Think about it, who else has ever shed their blood for you! Who else gives you freedom over death?

David stole my thunder here.

Who has shed blood for me? How about hundreds of thousands of American soldiers and sailors who have bled and died so that we can express ourselves here freely?

Freedom over death, indeed. It's a fiction, there is no such thing. We live, we die, same as your dog, only we take a bit longer.

I'm OK with that. At least I will have lived as a free man before I died, not enslaved to an an ancient ideology that demands my mind and soul. I feel so sorry for you, ngt, for wasting the only life you will ever have. Life is a gift, spending it wishing it were over is perverse and evil.

Excuse me if I forgo that option.


DF

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:

quote:

God's character has been, will be, and forever will be about freedom. That is the whole point of shedding His blood for us. Think about it, who else has ever shed their blood for you! Who else gives you freedom over death?

Who has shed blood for me? How about hundreds of thousands of American soldiers and sailors who have bled and died so that we can express ourselves here freely?

Freedom over death, indeed. It's a fiction, there is no such thing. We live, we die, same as your dog, only we take a bit longer.

I'm OK with that. At least I will have lived as a free man before I died, not enslaved to an an ancient ideology that demands my mind and soul. I feel so sorry for you, ngt, for wasting the only life you will ever have. Life is a gift, spending it wishing it were over is perverse and evil. Excuse me if I forgo that option. DF

Hi Deep,

You often remind me of a label I see in reference to politicians -- "talking heads." Why? Because I believe you, and folks like David, talk, or in the case of the forum, write -- just to hear your heads resonate.

Yes, over the years, many hundreds of thousands of Americans have died to secure your freedom to defame God. They died physically to secure your physical, legal freedom. Jesus Christ died to offer you Spiritual Freedom -- a much different subject altogether.

And, possibly you will die like a dog, as you suggested -- however, Christians have much more to look forward to in our eternal life. On the other hand, if you die still rejecting God -- you will wish you had it as good as your dog and only died. You and I will live eternally. This life is but a brief introduction to living; it is but a blink of the eye when compared to eternity. You tell NGT, "I feel so sorry for you, ngt, for wasting the only life you will ever have." How sadly mistaken you are, my Friend. He, God, offers you eternal life -- but, you are more concerned with how "cutesy" you can be in this short life. Now that, my Friend, is truly a wasted life.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

quote:

Originally posted by davidnmiles:

quote:

Originally posted by ngt2293:
God's character has been, will be, and forever will be about freedom. That is the whole point of shedding His blood for us. Think about it, who else has ever shed their blood for you! Who else gives you freedom over death?

You have insulted the thousands of brave men and women who truly have “shed their blood for” us. You apparently do not realize it, but men and women have shed their blood fighting wars on our behalf--wars that brought us and maintained our freedom..

God’s barbaric deed which shed Christ’s blood had nothing to do with humankind’s freedom. How did the crucifixion bring us freedom? The creators of the Christ myth realized that the crucifixion did nothing to improve humankind. Man was no more free after the crucifixion than before the alleged event. The solution was to concoct a story about a paradise that existed for believers after a miserable life on earth. Hence, the story goes that it does not matter that Christ did nothing to improve humanity because believers will end up in paradise after a brief stint on earth. Of course, there is not one shred of evidence that a paradise exists. There is overwhelming evidence that the crucifixion story has shackled men’s/women’s minds with superstition. While physical slavery in the Christian world has finally vanished after 1800 years, intellectual slavery is very much with us.

The only people who insult the military are the liberals like yourself who wouldn't stand up to defend squat so don't lecture me on our military when your President is consistently turning his back on them and bowing down to the King of Saudi Arabia. Most of the military is ashamed of Obama and have more respect for God than Obama.

Jesus Christ is God so once again you are blinded which is what Satan wants you to be.

Liberals destroy our freedoms!

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:

quote:

God's character has been, will be, and forever will be about freedom. That is the whole point of shedding His blood for us. Think about it, who else has ever shed their blood for you! Who else gives you freedom over death?

David stole my thunder here.

Who has shed blood for me? How about hundreds of thousands of American soldiers and sailors who have bled and died so that we can express ourselves here freely?

Freedom over death, indeed. It's a fiction, there is no such thing. We live, we die, same as your dog, only we take a bit longer.

I'm OK with that. At least I will have lived as a free man before I died, not enslaved to an an ancient ideology that demands my mind and soul. I feel so sorry for you, ngt, for wasting the only life you will ever have. Life is a gift, spending it wishing it were over is perverse and evil.

Excuse me if I forgo that option.


DF

Big difference DF animals do not have a spirit! Humans do! If you say you are like an animal then who am I to disagree. If you think like an ape then you more than likely came from apes, I on the other hand came from a Creator who gave me life, a body, soul, and spirit. Big difference because animals do not have spirits. They only have a body and soul (which is your personality)! DF it's not my job to convert you or even try to see you saved, that's God's job and Jesus clearly pointed this out in John 6 that the Father calls those whom He wants to be His children.

John 6 "This is why I told you earlier that no one is capable of coming to me on his own. You get to me only as a gift from the Father."

Sorry DF sorry David you two have been left out!

Nowhere does it say that God has to be fair, nowhere does it say that God has to love everyone, God is a God of choosing and He chooses who He wants to be His children. DF it took me seven years to accept His calling and there is nothing greater than hearing His voice asking you to be His child. Two choices child of the devil or a child of God. Which choice have you made?

quote:

Sorry DF sorry David you two have been left out!
God is a God of choosing and He chooses who He wants to be His children.

Well, that just set Christianity back a few 100 years or so. Being just a little judgmental and unforgiving there, ngt.

Jesus was about forgiveness and acceptance. He ate with the sinners and was kind to the thieves. He listened more than he talked. Never an unkind word even to Judas. On the Cross, He said "Forgive them, Father". Not forgive some of them or just the ones we like.

Christian acts, not empty words.

ngt states and asks, "Two choices child of the devil or a child of God. Which choice have you made?"

I have not chosen and will not choose to worship either of these mythical characters.

As you state, “"Nowhere does it say that God has to be fair, nowhere does it say that God has to love everyone, God is a God of choosing and He chooses who He wants to be His children.” A person who worships an unfair God who cares about some people and discriminates against others will demonstrate this same unfairness and intolerance toward their fellow men and women.

As for Satan, you say he is a bad guy. I’ll take your word for it.

"Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man."

ngt, if I'm left out of your clique, you just have to understand I'm thrilled about it.

DF

quote:

Originally posted by LMM:

quote:

Sorry DF sorry David you two have been left out!
God is a God of choosing and He chooses who He wants to be His children.

Well, that just set Christianity back a few 100 years or so. Being just a little judgmental and unforgiving there, ngt.

Jesus was about forgiveness and acceptance. He ate with the sinners and was kind to the thieves. He listened more than he talked. Never an unkind word even to Judas. On the Cross, He said "Forgive them, Father". Not forgive some of them or just the ones we like.

Christian acts, not empty words.

LMM Jesus is God of the Old Testament and New Testament they are the same!
Not true God shows His mercy and His hatred and when it rains down hatred it really rains down. Just ask the people of Sodom and Gomorrah. God chose the Jews to be His people and made a covenant with them, that covenant is still in place, but He also made a new convent with the gentiles by sending His Holy Spirit to dwell in us.

Who am I to say whom God calls, it’s His choice not mind, but when a human decides to reject God then they have already made that choice. It's a privilege to be called and it's a privilege to answer that call, but I can promise you it will be the hardest decision you will ever make.

quote:

Originally posted by davidnmiles:
ngt states and asks, "Two choices child of the devil or a child of God. Which choice have you made?"

I have not chosen and will not choose to worship either of these mythical characters.

As you state, “"Nowhere does it say that God has to be fair, nowhere does it say that God has to love everyone, God is a God of choosing and He chooses who He wants to be His children.” A person who worships an unfair God who cares about some people and discriminates against others will demonstrate this same unfairness and intolerance toward their fellow men and women.

As for Satan, you say he is a bad guy. I’ll take your word for it.

"Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man."

David I hate to say it but God does discriminate. He's God and has that choice. All through the bible you see where God does give people chances but then He drops the hammer and when the hammer falls its all over. Noah is a great example of this when millions died in the flood and billions will die in this next go around. Do you understand BILLIONS will die! The blood will be 6ft deep in the streets.

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:
ngt, if I'm left out of your clique, you just have to understand I'm thrilled about it.

DF

DF I understand and you know I will miss because we all have fun on here debating.

ngt,
Do you follow the Calvinist view of things?

quote:

Originally posted by ngt2293:

quote:

Originally posted by davidnmiles:
ngt states and asks, "Two choices child of the devil or a child of God. Which choice have you made?"

I have not chosen and will not choose to worship either of these mythical characters.

As you state, “"Nowhere does it say that God has to be fair, nowhere does it say that God has to love everyone, God is a God of choosing and He chooses who He wants to be His children.” A person who worships an unfair God who cares about some people and discriminates against others will demonstrate this same unfairness and intolerance toward their fellow men and women.

As for Satan, you say he is a bad guy. I’ll take your word for it.

"Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man."

David I hate to say it but God does discriminate. He's God and has that choice. All through the bible you see where God does give people chances but then He drops the hammer and when the hammer falls its all over. Noah is a great example of this when millions died in the flood and billions will die in this next go around. Do you understand BILLIONS will die! The blood will be 6ft deep in the streets.

What's he waiting for? Sounds like another 2,000 year rain delay.

BELIEF IN A CRUEL GOD MAKES A CRUEL MAN--Thomas Paine

ngt,

quote:

Do you understand BILLIONS will die! The blood will be 6ft deep in the streets.

That gives you a woody, doesn't it?

That's why nuclear weapons should not be left in the hands of the religious.


DF

quote:

Originally posted by davidnmiles:

quote:

Originally posted by ngt2293:

quote:

Originally posted by davidnmiles:
ngt states and asks, "Two choices child of the devil or a child of God. Which choice have you made?"

I have not chosen and will not choose to worship either of these mythical characters.

As you state, “"Nowhere does it say that God has to be fair, nowhere does it say that God has to love everyone, God is a God of choosing and He chooses who He wants to be His children.” A person who worships an unfair God who cares about some people and discriminates against others will demonstrate this same unfairness and intolerance toward their fellow men and women.

As for Satan, you say he is a bad guy. I’ll take your word for it.

"Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man."

David I hate to say it but God does discriminate. He's God and has that choice. All through the bible you see where God does give people chances but then He drops the hammer and when the hammer falls its all over. Noah is a great example of this when millions died in the flood and billions will die in this next go around. Do you understand BILLIONS will die! The blood will be 6ft deep in the streets.

What's he waiting for? Sounds like another 2,000 year rain delay.

BELIEF IN A CRUEL GOD MAKES A CRUEL MAN--Thomas Paine

He's waiting for people like you to make up your mind or He's waiting for those in the jungle to be given one more chance. That's one thing God is known for mercy but eventually He get's a little tired of all the bs.

that makes two of us.


DF

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:
ngt,

quote:

Do you understand BILLIONS will die! The blood will be 6ft deep in the streets.

That gives you a woody, doesn't it?

That's why nuclear weapons should not be left in the hands of the religious.


DF

DF Those dying will be people in China and Russia when they go against Israel and try to destroy them. It will be War World III and the blood will be deep.

I was right.

Don't elect evangelicals to public office, folks.


DF

Hi NGT,

You tell Deep, "DF, it's not my job to convert you or even try to see you saved. That's God's job and Jesus clearly pointed this out in John 6 that the Father calls those whom He wants to be His children. John 6 "This is why I told you earlier that no one is capable of coming to me on his own. You get to me only as a gift from the Father." Sorry DF, sorry David, you two have been left out!"

First, let me emphasize that everyone, while breath is left in their earthly bodies, still has an opportunity to invite Jesus into their hearts, to be saved. That includes Deep, David, and all of our atheist, secularist, humanist, and other non-believing Friends. Until one breathes that last breath -- there is always the possibility for salvation -- just like the thief on the cross. If anyone chooses to continue denying Jesus Christ until after that last breath -- then he/she has condemned himself/herself to eternal hell.

NGT, I am not sure which Scripture verse you reference in your comment; but, I let me share some verses from my NAS Bible.

John 5:24, "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life."

John 6:35, "Jesus said to them, 'I am the bread of life; he who comes to Me will not hunger, and he who believes in Me will never thirst.'"

John 6:40, "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."

John 6:47, "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life."

Possibly the Scripture verse you are thinking of is John 6:65, "And He was saying, 'For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him from the Father.'"

To understand this verse, we must look back at the events which led up to Him saying this. In John 6:41-51, the Jews complained when Jesus said, "I am the bread that came down out of heaven." In this passage, Jesus compares Himself to the Wilderness Manna -- which God sent to save the Israelites who were wandering in the wilderness. Jesus was declaring that He had come down out of heaven, just as the manna, to save all the people who are wandering in the wilderness of our fallen world.

Then, in John 6:52-59, Jesus explains further that true spiritual life comes to us through the body and blood of Jesus Christ which was sacrificed on the cross. Not that we physically eat the literal body and blood of Christ -- but, that in remembering, honoring, and believing the sacrifice He made for us; we gain spiritual life.

In John 6:50-65, Jesus explains to His disciples, the crowd of people who were listening to His teachings (not just His apostles and followers) that the Spirit, the Holy Spirit, gives life -- and the flesh profits them nothing. What does He mean by this? Earlier in John 6, Jesus had fed the five thousand with only the five barley loaves and two fish. And, He knew that many of those listening to His teachings were only there because of the miracle they had seen Him perform with the food. They were still thinking only in terms of earthly food, fleshly food; while He was teaching about spiritual food.

And, He tells them, "For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him from the Father." How does God the Father send people to Jesus Christ? In Ephesians 2:8 we are told, "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast."

By grace! What does this mean? Strong's Concordance tells us that "grace," in Greek "charis" -- means: "good will, loving-kindness, favor -- as of the merciful kindness by which God, exerting his holy influence upon souls, turns them to Christ, keeps, strengthens, increases them in Christian faith, knowledge, affection, and kindles them to the exercise of the Christian virtues."

So, by this special, merciful, unmerited favor of God -- by grace -- the Holy Spirit works within our hearts to draw us toward a loving, saving relationship with Jesus Christ.

He draws us; but, given our gift of "free will" -- we still have the choice of receiving Him or rejecting Him. That is the second part of Ephesians 2:8, ". . . you have been saved through faith. . ." If, when the Holy Spirit draws us, we realize that Jesus Christ is waiting at the door of our hearts to be invited to come in and become our personal, intimate, saving Friend -- if we open the door of our hearts, invite Him to come in and be our personal Lord and Savior (Revelation 3:20) -- "we have been saved through faith" in Jesus Christ.

If we harden our hearts and refuse to acknowledge Him, refuse to invite Him in -- then, by our own choice we are denying Jesus Christ. And, if we continue to do that until we have breathed our last breath -- then, by our own "free will" -- we have chosen to spend eternity in hell.

So, NGT, our atheist, secularist, humanist, and other non-believing Friends still have time to -- by grace through faith -- believe in Jesus Christ, invite Him in, and spend eternity with God rather than Satan.

NGT, you tell Deep, "DF, it's not my job to convert you or even try to see you saved. . ."

While you are right that we cannot convert anyone; only the Holy Spirit harvest a soul, can lead a person to Christ -- we have been given the task of sharing the Word with all who are not believers. In Matthew 28:19-20, Jesus Himself tells us to Go, Make Disciples, Baptize Them, Teach Them.

What does this mean? It means that we are to leave our comfort zones and go out into the world, find the unsaved, and share the Gospel of Jesus Christ with them. That is the GO. MAKING DISCIPLES is when we encourage them -- by the example of our saved lives, by sharing the Word of God with them -- to want to know more about the Gospel, to want to know more about Jesus Christ and salvation. We are given the task of helping them prepare their hearts and making it ready for the harvest of the Holy Spirit.

Then, when the Holy Spirit has worked in their hearts, when they have, of their own "free will" -- invited Jesus Christ to come into their hearts -- they are saved. At this time, we BAPTIZE them as a declaration to the world that they have become Christian believers and Christ Followers. Now, they are Babes In Christ, just beginning to learn to walk with their newly found spiritual legs -- and we must TEACH them as He has taught us. This is the heart of Matthew 28:19-20.

And, to add emphasis to this Great Commission found in Matthew 28:19-20, to add backbone to that teaching; He tells us in Acts 1:8 to be His witnesses in our Jerusalem (our home, our family, our community, our city), in our Judea and our Samaria (our state and our nation); and to the remotest part of the earth -- our world; a fallen world heavily populated with unsaved souls.

No, we are not to become Couch Potato Christians -- we are to be His witnesses in all the world -- starting always with our own family.

So, NGT, while we cannot personally save anyone -- we can surely prepare the soil, do the planting of seeds -- and have it ready for the Holy Spirit to do the harvesting.

Get you seeds and your hoe ready -- and let's hit the field to do some soul-saving seed planting.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

Hi NGT: You were talking about Noah… As usual, there is a grain of truth in every superstition… Here is a little background on Noah and the big “flood”.

About 7,000 years ago, the great civilization in Mesopotamia was disintegrating. For thousands of years, the best stocks of these great peoples had poured out of this birthplace of civilization: Mostly into Europe, but also into North Africa (Egypt), Crete and, to some extent, Asia. But the deathblow to this great civilization came from progressive geologic changes. As a part of the natural geologic evolution of the planet, the mountains about the eastern coast of the Mediterranean and those to the northwest and northeast of Mesopotamia continued to rise. This elevation of the highlands was greatly accelerated about 5000 B.C., and this, together with greatly increased snowfall on the northern mountains, caused unprecedented floods each spring throughout the Euphrates valley. These spring floods grew increasingly worse so that eventually the inhabitants of the river regions were driven to the eastern highlands. For almost a thousand years scores of cities were practically deserted because of these extensive deluges.

Almost five thousand years later, as the Hebrew priests in Babylonian captivity sought to trace the Jewish people back to Adam, they found great difficulty in piecing the story together; and it occurred to one of them to abandon the effort, to let the whole world drown in its wickedness at the time of Noah's flood, and thus to be in a better position to trace Abraham right back to one of the three surviving sons of Noah.

The traditions of a time when water covered the whole of the earth's surface are universal. Many races harbor the story of a world-wide flood some time during past ages. The Biblical story of Noah, the ark, and the flood is an invention of the Hebrew priesthood during the Babylonian captivity. There has never been a universal flood since the beginnings of life on earth. The only time the surface of the earth was completely covered by water was during those Archeozoic ages before the land had begun to appear.

But Noah really lived; he was a wine maker of Aram, a river settlement near Erech. He kept a written record of the days of the river's rise from year to year. He brought much ridicule upon himself by going up and down the river valley advocating that all houses be built of wood, boat fashion, and that the family animals be put on board each night as the flood season approached. He would go to the neighboring river settlements every year and warn them that in so many days the floods would come. Finally a year came in which the annual floods were greatly augmented by unusually heavy rainfall so that the sudden rise of the waters wiped out the entire village; only Noah and his immediate family were saved in their houseboat.

Just thought you might want to know!
Al

quote:

Originally posted by alwilliams767:
Hi NGT: You were talking about Noah… As usual, there is a grain of truth in every superstition… Here is a little background on Noah and the big “flood”.

About 7,000 years ago, the great civilization in Mesopotamia was disintegrating. For thousands of years, the best stocks of these great peoples had poured out of this birthplace of civilization: Mostly into Europe, but also into North Africa (Egypt), Crete and, to some extent, Asia. But the deathblow to this great civilization came from progressive geologic changes. As a part of the natural geologic evolution of the planet, the mountains about the eastern coast of the Mediterranean and those to the northwest and northeast of Mesopotamia continued to rise. This elevation of the highlands was greatly accelerated about 5000 B.C., and this, together with greatly increased snowfall on the northern mountains, caused unprecedented floods each spring throughout the Euphrates valley. These spring floods grew increasingly worse so that eventually the inhabitants of the river regions were driven to the eastern highlands. For almost a thousand years scores of cities were practically deserted because of these extensive deluges.

Almost five thousand years later, as the Hebrew priests in Babylonian captivity sought to trace the Jewish people back to Adam, they found great difficulty in piecing the story together; and it occurred to one of them to abandon the effort, to let the whole world drown in its wickedness at the time of Noah's flood, and thus to be in a better position to trace Abraham right back to one of the three surviving sons of Noah.

The traditions of a time when water covered the whole of the earth's surface are universal. Many races harbor the story of a world-wide flood some time during past ages. The Biblical story of Noah, the ark, and the flood is an invention of the Hebrew priesthood during the Babylonian captivity. There has never been a universal flood since the beginnings of life on earth. The only time the surface of the earth was completely covered by water was during those Archeozoic ages before the land had begun to appear.

But Noah really lived; he was a wine maker of Aram, a river settlement near Erech. He kept a written record of the days of the river's rise from year to year. He brought much ridicule upon himself by going up and down the river valley advocating that all houses be built of wood, boat fashion, and that the family animals be put on board each night as the flood season approached. He would go to the neighboring river settlements every year and warn them that in so many days the floods would come. Finally a year came in which the annual floods were greatly augmented by unusually heavy rainfall so that the sudden rise of the waters wiped out the entire village; only Noah and his immediate family were saved in their houseboat.

Just thought you might want to know!
Al

Al,

Are you claiming that any order we might ,one at a time, remove your claims result in the last item as being a truth?

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:
I was right.

Don't elect evangelicals to public office, folks.


DF

Hopefully we learned this lesson after George
W. Bush.

It is truly amazing that there exists within the various philosophies of Christianity, a small (at least I hope they are a small) group of misguided individuals who actually want the horror of a nuclear Armageddon, an event which they mistakenly interpret as being simultaneous with the return of Jesus.

NGT appears to be a member of this persuasion.

I wholeheartedly agree with Deep that it is vital to the future of civilization to keep these fanatics out of office.

Ram:
I’m sorry, but I did not quite understand your message. Are you trying to say that by quoting various biblical passages that you actually proved something? I guess I missed that. Possibly there may be something of value buried inside one of Bill’s ranting responses? Unfortunately I never read those, amusing as they are, they are generally far too predictable.

quote:

Originally posted by davidnmiles:

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:
I was right.

Don't elect evangelicals to public office, folks.


DF

Hopefully we learned this lesson after George
W. Bush.

At least when Bush mentioned God, it was genuine.

Link

Obama invokes Jesus more than Bush
Politico

Eamon Javers Eamon Javers – Tue Jun 9, 5:09 am ET

He’s done it while talking about abortion and the Middle East, even the economy. The references serve at once as an affirmation of his faith and a rebuke against a rumor that persists for some to this day.

As president, Barack Obama has mentioned Jesus Christ in a number of high-profile public speeches — something his predecessor George W. Bush rarely did in such settings, even though Bush’s Christian faith was at the core of his political identity.

In his speech Thursday in Cairo, Obama told the crowd that he is a Christian and mentioned the Islamic story of Isra, in which Moses, Jesus and Mohammed joined in prayer.

At the University of Notre Dame on May 17, Obama talked about the good works he’d seen done by Christian community groups in Chicago. “I found myself drawn — not just to work with the church but to be in the church,” Obama said. “It was through this service that I was brought to Christ.”

And a month before that, Obama mentioned Jesus’ Sermon on the Mount at Georgetown University to make the case for his economic policies. Obama retold the story of two men, one who built his house on a pile of sand and the other who built his on a rock: “We cannot rebuild this economy on the same pile of sand,” Obama said. “We must build our house upon a rock.”

More than four months into the Obama presidency, a picture is emerging of a chief executive who is comfortable with public displays of his religion — although he has also paid tribute to other faiths and those he called “nonbelievers” during his inaugural address.

Obama’s invocation of the Christian Messiah is more overt than Americans heard in the public rhetoric of Bush in his time in the White House — even though Bush’s victories were powered in part by evangelical voters.

“I don’t recall a single example of Bush as president ever saying, ‘Jesus’ or ‘Christ,’” said Tony Perkins, president of the conservative Christian group Family Research Council. “This is different.”

quote:

Originally posted by alwilliams767:
It is truly amazing that there exists within the various philosophies of Christianity, a small (at least I hope they are a small) group of misguided individuals who actually want the horror of a nuclear Armageddon, an event which they mistakenly interpret as being simultaneous with the return of Jesus.

NGT appears to be a member of this persuasion.

I wholeheartedly agree with Deep that it is vital to the future of civilization to keep these fanatics out of office.

Ram:
I’m sorry, but I did not quite understand your message. Are you trying to say that by quoting various biblical passages that you actually proved something? I guess I missed that. Possibly there may be something of value buried inside one of Bill’s ranting responses? Unfortunately I never read those, amusing as they are, they are generally far too predictable.

al
The Noah thing to which it was attached.

I’ve never read anything like this. I was wondering if it is a justified belief on your part that we could consider knowledge.

“At least when Bush mentioned God, it was genuine.”

Yes, it was, and that is what was so troublesome. All presidents in my lifetime have made references to God and Jesus. Normally, I could assume that this was nothing more than pandering to a less than brilliant electorate. However, shortly into the Bush presidency I found myself saying, “This idiot actually believes this stuff."

Regrettably, his actions spoke as loud as his words; hence the reason that this evangelical should never have been president.

He got advice from his “heavenly” father before invading Iraq.
He stood in the way of science, e.g., opposed stem cell research.
He stated that teaching creationism should be given equal time with evolution.
He nominated Christian conservatives for the Supreme Court.
He used a pro-life, religious litmus test when making appointments. For example, the justice department was packed with inept lawyers from Regent University rather than top law schools.
He opposed a women’s right to choose, at the same time that he itched for war and supported gun ownership.
He incessantly babbled “God bless America” rather than actually taking action to “bless” America.
He told victims of natural disasters that the best thing they could do is pray.
Every time he opened his mouth he proved that reason was alien to his psyche.

Hi folks,

We must all keep in mind that when Al copy/pastes his messages -- it is all from the Urantia Book, the New Age bible.

All we can know about Noah and the flood is what we read in the Bible. So, any great explanation of the flood or Noah's character in the Urantia Book is a figment of some New Age guru's imagination.

If the Bible talks about it; so can we. If the Bible is quiet on the subject -- we can speculate, we can discuss -- but, we can never teach it as the absolute truth as Al has attempted to do.

We, through archeology and science, have seen the results of the great flood -- and we can learn from what this teaches. But, the final authority on Noah and the flood is the Bible -- not a New Age guru's vivid imagination.

Al, you can flavor your New Age teaching with the latest Oprah gospels or whatever -- it is still New Age misinformation. Even when you attempt to put on your Christian hat -- you are still teaching worn-out New Age rhetoric.

Why not try to get to know the real Jesus Christ and find true Christianity? You will be eternally grateful if you do.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

“This idiot actually believes this stuff."

So it bothers you more that he was honest than a hypocrite like Obaba?

''He got advice from his “heavenly” father before invading Iraq.''

This statement is false, made up by a reporter. Check it yourself.
He did say he felt God wanted him to run for pres.

Some of the other statements are false as well, but I get the picture. You hate anyone claiming to be a Christian in government or mentioning prayer in public.

I'll take someone who 'claims' to talk to a higher power over someone who thinks THEY ARE A HIGHER POWER!

After Obaba gets through and we have a socialist society, everyone will be equally poor and prayer will be all the rage!

Hi Ram:
Sorry about that. I really did not understand your question. The information I posted is out of the Urantia Book. I hesitate at saying that it could be considered "knowledge", because I have no way of proving it.

I believe it, but I am reluctant to give the ol' "Bill" Give and Go, the "my way or the highway", because faith, and belief in things which one can not demonstrate absolute proof, are more of a personal thing.

Bill, (I see he responded, the old Crusader), I'm sure gave his pat answer on how anything out of the bible is devilish, leading the lambs astray, not to be believed, etc...

Once again, however, I do not bother to read past the first line or 2 or his tirades.

On Obama:
Now that guy is acting like a Christain is supposed to! He is much more of an ideal Christian than someone like Bill (then again, who isn't?)

Al

quote:

On Obama:
Now that guy is acting like a Christain is supposed to! He is much more of an ideal Christian than someone like Bill (then again, who isn't?)

Ummm, you mean forcing the take over of banks, businesses and bankrupting the economy which will bankrupt us all?

Or the forcing of sharing the wealth, which Jesus told us to help one another out of love not a gun to our head.

Or to take care of the sick and starving, not line everyone up at a food bank because they all lost their jobs due to idiotic Keynesian economic policies that ONLY work in undeveloped countries?

Al, believe ever how you wish but don't expect me to buy Obama as a Christian. He is a sleezy socialist/fascist and a sorry apologist.

Hi Al,

Just a thought.

This is screaming; either out of anger, frustration -- or merely, in a moment of feeling insecure, to draw attention to yourself:

BILL GRAY DOESN’T WANT YOU TO READ THIS:

This is communicating:

Bill Gray Doesn't Want You To Read This:

By the way, it is still not too late to go back and edit your initial post -- to eliminate your "look at me" headline.

Why not join us in civil discussions without the screaming?

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

quote:

Originally posted by LMM:
“This idiot actually believes this stuff."

''He got advice from his “heavenly” father before invading Iraq.''

This statement is false, made up by a reporter. Check it yourself.

Given that Bush is a devout Christian, DO YOU BELIEVE that he asked God for wisdom before he made the decission to invade Iraq? Yes or No.

quote:

Originally posted by alwilliams767:
Hi NGT: You were talking about Noah… As usual, there is a grain of truth in every superstition… Here is a little background on Noah and the big “flood”.

About 7,000 years ago, the great civilization in Mesopotamia was disintegrating. For thousands of years, the best stocks of these great peoples had poured out of this birthplace of civilization: Mostly into Europe, but also into North Africa (Egypt), Crete and, to some extent, Asia. But the deathblow to this great civilization came from progressive geologic changes. As a part of the natural geologic evolution of the planet, the mountains about the eastern coast of the Mediterranean and those to the northwest and northeast of Mesopotamia continued to rise. This elevation of the highlands was greatly accelerated about 5000 B.C., and this, together with greatly increased snowfall on the northern mountains, caused unprecedented floods each spring throughout the Euphrates valley. These spring floods grew increasingly worse so that eventually the inhabitants of the river regions were driven to the eastern highlands. For almost a thousand years scores of cities were practically deserted because of these extensive deluges.

Almost five thousand years later, as the Hebrew priests in Babylonian captivity sought to trace the Jewish people back to Adam, they found great difficulty in piecing the story together; and it occurred to one of them to abandon the effort, to let the whole world drown in its wickedness at the time of Noah's flood, and thus to be in a better position to trace Abraham right back to one of the three surviving sons of Noah.

The traditions of a time when water covered the whole of the earth's surface are universal. Many races harbor the story of a world-wide flood some time during past ages. The Biblical story of Noah, the ark, and the flood is an invention of the Hebrew priesthood during the Babylonian captivity. There has never been a universal flood since the beginnings of life on earth. The only time the surface of the earth was completely covered by water was during those Archeozoic ages before the land had begun to appear.

But Noah really lived; he was a wine maker of Aram, a river settlement near Erech. He kept a written record of the days of the river's rise from year to year. He brought much ridicule upon himself by going up and down the river valley advocating that all houses be built of wood, boat fashion, and that the family animals be put on board each night as the flood season approached. He would go to the neighboring river settlements every year and warn them that in so many days the floods would come. Finally a year came in which the annual floods were greatly augmented by unusually heavy rainfall so that the sudden rise of the waters wiped out the entire village; only Noah and his immediate family were saved in their houseboat.

Just thought you might want to know!
Al

Al I understand what you are saying and as most humans do I could question the stories in the Bible and have question a few. But when I read, God inspires all scriptures; I then have to take another look at it. Maybe during this climate change Noah's Ark might be discovered and maybe not, but by faith I still believe that these things happened. You know Al if I'm wrong then I have lived a happy life, serving an invisible but personable God. A God who watches over me, a God who sends His angels to protect me, and a God who dwells inside of me. I wouldn’t trade this for anything in the world and I sure as heck would never want to go back to my old self and my old style of life. God’s too cool to go backwards and just looking at Abraham’s life why would anyone want to go backwards, there are too many rewards in our future.

Sad, but often true--Ignorance is bliss.

quote:

Originally posted by alwilliams767:
It is truly amazing that there exists within the various philosophies of Christianity, a small (at least I hope they are a small) group of misguided individuals who actually want the horror of a nuclear Armageddon, an event which they mistakenly interpret as being simultaneous with the return of Jesus.

NGT appears to be a member of this persuasion.

I wholeheartedly agree with Deep that it is vital to the future of civilization to keep these fanatics out of office.

Ram:
I’m sorry, but I did not quite understand your message. Are you trying to say that by quoting various biblical passages that you actually proved something? I guess I missed that. Possibly there may be something of value buried inside one of Bill’s ranting responses? Unfortunately I never read those, amusing as they are, they are generally far too predictable.

Al, World War III will never be nuclear that would be too easy and the streets would never run six feet deep with blood. God doesn't need nuclear bombs, just read Revelations or Daniel. This is not something I am hoping for but it will happen. We live on a spiritual earth, good against evil, and right now evil is winning the battle. Once all the Christians are taken out of the world, then yes all hell will break loose in about 3 years so be prepared. You will know once the rapture occurs.