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Recently my daughter's boyfriend fell off a ladder on the job and had to go to the ER. He only sprained his wrist, but the young man who hired him told him to tell everyone he fell while hanging christmas lights because he did not have a contractor's license and could be fined for working without one. The "boss" is 18 yrs. old,the young man who fell is 16 yrs. old.

My question is can an 18 yr. old actually obtain a contractor's license and if he is operating without one who would it be reported to.
I've recently obtained a new, more positive outlook on life. Things are not always as they seem nor as bad as we think they are. Thank you Lord for opening my eyes!
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The state of Alabama requires any general contractor working on a commercial or industrial project costing $50,000 or more to get a license. If you're the general contractor on a residential project that costs $10,000 or more, you need a license.

Look at Chapter 8 of Title 34, Code of Alabama, 1975

Also LINK

The Compliance/Regulatory Division for Alabama number is 334-272-5030

The investigator for north Alabama number is 334-328-2629
Please do not report an 18 yr old for working without a contractor's license. I am a licensed contractor and even I think this is beyond ridiculous.

Getting this young man's injury treated at the hospital has nothing to do with him getting 'fined' for working without a contractors license. Any employer in any type business is liable for injuries if an employee gets hurt on the job.

Does the 16 yr old have health insurance? Through a family policy maybe? If so, he definitely should have told them he did it at home hanging xmas lights or whatever. His medical policy will not pay if they know he injured himself on the job working for someone. These type injuries are expected to be taken care of through the employers workmans compensation policy.

I'm betting that the 18 yr old kid doesnt carry workmans comp. It is expensive as he11.

The 18 yr old kid probably doesnt even know why he told the 16 yr old that. He is more than likely just relaying what he has been told while working for others.
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:
Please do not report an 18 yr old for working without a contractor's license. I am a licensed contractor and even I think this is beyond ridiculous.

Getting this young man's injury treated at the hospital has nothing to do with him getting 'fined' for working without a contractors license. Any employer in any type business is liable for injuries if an employee gets hurt on the job.

Does the 16 yr old have health insurance? Through a family policy maybe? If so, he definitely should have told them he did it at home hanging xmas lights or whatever. His medical policy will not pay if they know he injured himself on the job working for someone. These type injuries are expected to be taken care of through the employers workmans compensation policy.

I'm betting that the 18 yr old kid doesnt carry workmans comp. It is expensive as he11.

The 18 yr old kid probably doesnt even know why he told the 16 yr old that. He is more than likely just relaying what he has been told while working for others.


I respectfully disagree the law exists to protect the customer, existing licensed contractors and for Tax revenue. If the 18 yr old guy wants to do business he should abide but the law. Also telling someone to lie to get a benefit is partially what is wrong with America.
This is the type thing that makes it hard for anyone to run a business. Accidents happen, but they are not all reasons to run and report something. Then we wonder why insurance rates are so high, litigation is so prevelant and people are hesitant to agree to do the work. So long as the worker was taken care of it is between the employee and the employer. It is doubtful that the worker would sue the homeowner for the accident although I'm sure that can happen. And in this economy people are looking for work and it's jobs like this that they can get -- and if every little thing gets reported -- even those jobs won't be available...give the kid a break...

As to the question of can an 18 year old own and run a business -- even a construction business. -- the answer is yes. I agree with Maynard he probably doesn't have Workers Comp insurance -- which it used to be that unless he had more than 3 employees (or is it 5) he was not required to carry it. And it is very expensive. the rules have changed on that over the years but I think that is still the rule of thumb. So if it is just him, the 16 year old and say another 20 year old -- he is still doing what he is supposed to do because as teh "owner" he is "exempt" and he only has 2 employees. He probablly said "license" but doesn't truly understand what he is talking about. It's not like there is a checklist of what is required to run a business...most find it out through trial and error. He probably worked for another contractor and used info he heard from them but didn't really understand.

If he was working for another contractor as a sub -- their insurance will cover the kids accident and will protect the customer as well as the main contractor. Their licenses would also cover the subcontractor in this situation. A guy I dated hurt his back and filed it under WC and WC wouldn't allow him to go to the chiropractor -- only a medical doctor and then they limited how much they covered...he even said he should have said he did it at home moving furniture so he would have had more control over his healthcare.

While doing work on certain projects does require a Homebuilder's License or a General Contractor's License -- he is not and will not be the last "contractor" out there trying to earn a living doing the best he can. He should have a City Business License and a State Business license -- that is where the tax revenue comes from -- not the HOmebuilders or GC license. Insurance of any kind -- liability or WC is not required unless there are X employees. But it is better to be safe than sorry and many learn that the hard way. Again this economy dictates what is "necessity" and what is "optional" for many.

There are many good contractors that work out of the back of their pickup and do a great job and don't have insurance, licenses or anything...And when you expect General contractors or construction companies to compete with the "no overhead" and still have a cheap price -- no offense, but you get what you pay for sometimes...not all "good ol boys are good" but many that I've known over the years are worth every penny and more. My brother built a house and used a General because the size of the project required it and then my dad has worked construction most of his life. He never had employees (my brother would call it slave labor lolololol...) and he never had anything more than a business license -- unless the job required a bond. I don't even remember him ever having liability insurance. If something went wrong -- it came out of his pocket and that was the end of it. He worked on small projects on his own and for several of the bigger construction companies over the years. He is "retired" but still gets called to do certain projects by the big boys because his reputation precedes him. :-)

As far as healthcare, if the kid has health insurance maynard is right that if he tells them he did it on the job -- his private policy won't cover a dime and If he doesn't have WC -- it is out of pocket expense and that can get ugly. I'm sure the "employer" can work something out to help him out with expenses. Or if they were working under a General -- they would have options to file under their policy... Either way, it is still part of the agreement between the employer and the employee.

However, a 16 year old is required to have a Work Permit...not sure how that will affect what happened if he doesn't...
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:
Please do not report an 18 yr old for working without a contractor's license. I am a licensed contractor and even I think this is beyond ridiculous.

Getting this young man's injury treated at the hospital has nothing to do with him getting 'fined' for working without a contractors license. Any employer in any type business is liable for injuries if an employee gets hurt on the job.

Does the 16 yr old have health insurance? Through a family policy maybe? If so, he definitely should have told them he did it at home hanging xmas lights or whatever. His medical policy will not pay if they know he injured himself on the job working for someone. These type injuries are expected to be taken care of through the employers workmans compensation policy.

I'm betting that the 18 yr old kid doesnt carry workmans comp. It is expensive as he11.

The 18 yr old kid probably doesnt even know why he told the 16 yr old that. He is more than likely just relaying what he has been told while working for others.


I just lost a lot of respect for you Maynard when you suggested that they lie to cover up for the 18 year old not being a responsible employer.
I would go lenient on the 18 year old but at the same time this is his responsibility and he might as well learn his lesson now. When an injured employee goes to the hospital it is neither here nor there if the employer has a license or not, the only thing that matters to the hospital is how it is going to be paid for. I would think his health insurance would cover the cost in the absence of workers comp however the health insurance company might have recourse to collect from the employer. Additionally in Alabama small contractors (I think 5 employees or less) can exempt from having to carry worker's comp insurance but this does leave the contractor open to a lot of liability. As for a license, if the contractor is just doing small jobs all he has to do is go to the courthouse and get a business license. If he does larger jobs it is a bit more complex however the business license is all that is required if he is doing small jobs and if the line at the courthouse is short this would have taken him about 20 minutes and not very much money.
quote:
Originally posted by ms. wonka:
Recently my daughter's boyfriend fell off a ladder on the job and had to go to the ER. He only sprained his wrist, but the young man who hired him told him to tell everyone he fell while hanging christmas lights because he did not have a contractor's license and could be fined for working without one. The "boss" is 18 yrs. old,the young man who fell is 16 yrs. old.

My question is can an 18 yr. old actually obtain a contractor's license and if he is operating without one who would it be reported to.


I'm curious too, you said the young man hired him...were they friends and decided to work together during the holidays for extra cash or did another friend help him get the job? In other words, what kind of arrangement was in place? WAs it as a 1099 contract employee or is he holding out taxes? All of that can play into what the responsibility of the "employer" is as well.

When I worked for the company that worked on Helen Keller in college -- they wouldn't hire anyone less than 18 and they had to be 21 to drive a vehicle. We also required every sub to provide proof of insurance -- both liability and workers comp -- as well as a bid bond. It eliminated the fly by nights and helped us when we had to sue one of our subs for making a major error and getting it fixed.
Contractors license isnt the issue really. Unless it is a large job. But the city license is. You can be fined if that particular city asks you to produce one. Tuscumbia enforces it and Sheffield to some extent. Florence not so much. You get those licenses at the city hall of any city. Prices vary.
To answer your question, I think an 18 yr old can get a contractors license.
One cost of doing business is being responsible. I am a licensed contractor, pay for workmans compensation and just as the 18 year old who hired the 16 year old, am responsible for the safety of my employee's while on my time.
It is not fair for me to have to compete with someone who is not on the same playing field level as I.
In the state of Alabama, it is not legal for an employee 16 years to do certain construction jobs where there is safety hazards. When it goes to court the employer will be held responsible for all medical costs.
Actually to the question at hand, it has nothing to do with a contractors license. the employer is going to be responsible of the medical bills. It would be to his advantage to pay the bills and it will be over with.
Even though I pay for worker's compensation, there has been several times where I paid to have an employee stitched up out of my pocket just to eliminate the hassle.
quote:
Originally posted by Sassy Kims:
I just lost a lot of respect for you Maynard when you suggested that they lie to cover up for the 18 year old not being a responsible employer.



I wasn't saying the things i said earlier to be noble. It is simply the truth. It is what tradesman have had to do for decades, due to coming up working for employers and subcontractors who do not have workman's comp.

"IF YOU FALL, YOU ARE FIRED BEFORE YOU HIT THE GROUND."

I cannot tell you how many times I heard this when i first got into the construction trade. It is a standing "rule" to insure that men are hurt on their own time and not on the clock. Yes, it is impossible to implement and shady as he11. I didn't make it up... I just heard it over and over and over through the years.

Eventually I finally did land a decent job as a superintendent for a rather large general contractor..... He bought family health insurance policies for all of his men, because it was still cheaper that buying a comp package for a builder of his volume. Accordingly, we were told what to say and how to act at the hospital if an injury did occur.

My earlier views are not extreme. It is the way a young tradesman comes up. I guess i could compare it to evolution. Tradesman have changed the way they handle things to make sure their *** is covered. We didn't implement the healthcare/workmans comp system. We simply landed smack in the middle of it .... usually through a long line of bad decisions earlier in life (i used to be the branch manager of a bank).

In other words..... It is simply survival. You want to slam me for suggesting to be deceitful to make sure one's injuries are taken care of? Fine.... but be sure you slam the "system" in your next breath. This "system" can illicit dishonest behavior in otherwise honest men. I've seen it a million times.

I only speak the truth.
Last edited by Maynard J. Keenan
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:
quote:
Originally posted by Sassy Kims:
I just lost a lot of respect for you Maynard when you suggested that they lie to cover up for the 18 year old not being a responsible employer.



I wasn't saying the things i said earlier to be noble. It is simply the truth. It is what tradesman have had to do for decades, due to coming up working for employers and subcontractors who do not have workman's comp.

"IF YOU FALL, YOU ARE FIRED BEFORE YOU HIT THE GROUND."

I cannot tell you how many times I heard this when i first got into the construction trade. It is a standing "rule" to insure that men are hurt on their own time and not on the clock. Yes, it is impossible to implement and shady as he11. I didn't make it up... I just heard it over and over and over through the years.

Eventually I finally did land a decent job as a superintendent for a rather large general contractor..... He bought family health insurance policies for all of his men, because it was still cheaper that buying a comp package for a builder of his volume. Accordingly, we were told what to say and how to act at the hospital if an injury did occur.

My earlier views are not extreme. It is the way a young tradesman comes up. I guess i could compare it to evolution. Tradesman have changed the way they handle things to make sure their *** is covered. We didn't implement the healthcare/workmans comp system. We simply landed smack in the middle of it .... usually through a long line of bad decisions earlier in life (i used to be the branch manager of a bank).

In other words..... It is simply survival. You want to slam me for suggesting to be deceitful to make sure one's injuries are taken care of? Fine.... but be sure you slam the "system" in your next breath. This "system" can illicit dishonest behavior in otherwise honest men. I've seen it a million times.

I only speak the truth.


It's still dishonesty if you require someone working for YOU to lie to obtain medical treatment. Any responsible employer carries worker's comp insurance.

I know employers don't always do it...still doesn't make it ethical or right. Still should not absolve them of their responsibility to pay for the employee's medical treatment when the employee is injured while working for them.

Economics is not a viable reason for dishonesty.
Maynard J. Keenan, You need to wake up to the times. The old adage you speak of does not work any more. If you are a legitimate contractor in any form, you are held accountable for every dollar you pay someone.
My certification authority does not allow me to have any 1099 employees. If they work for me, then they are my bona-fide employee. regardless if I have workman's comp or not, I am responsible for any injury's they receive on the job. Just one litigation before a Judge and you will soon realize you cannot afford to not pay for workman's compensation.
They are going to get you one way or another. I sleep good at night knowing I don't have to worry if my employee's are going to sue me for medical bills while hurt on my job.
Sassy, you see things in absolutes... black or white.... right or wrong. There's nothing wrong with that, and the moral majority needs folks like you to keep its minions scared straight, but I'm not here to debate ethics. I am about to say something that will shock you .... ready? ... here goes...

Throughout our lives on this planet, there may arise times when it is appropriate to be dishonest.



quote:
Originally posted by unclegus:Just one litigation before a Judge and you will soon realize you cannot afford to not pay for workman's compensation.


No it will not, because I will never be litigated. I have carried liability & workmans's comp for over 5 years now.

You sir are the relic who needs to wake up. You are a jobsite antique who will soon be replaced and forgotten by younger men who do things quicker and better.

It is absolutely naive of you to not consider the plight of the tradesman who may initially work or train under an uninsured sub.
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:
Sassy, you see things in absolutes... black or white.... right or wrong. There's nothing wrong with that, and the moral majority needs folks like you to keep its minions scared straight, but I'm not here to debate ethics. I am about to say something that will shock you .... ready? ... here goes...

Throughout our lives on this planet, there may arise times when it is appropriate to be dishonest.



quote:
Originally posted by unclegus:Just one litigation before a Judge and you will soon realize you cannot afford to not pay for workman's compensation.


No it will not, because I will never be litigated. I have carried liability & workmans's comp for over 5 years now.

You sir are the relic who needs to wake up. You are a job site antique who will soon be replaced and forgotten by younger men who do things quicker and better.

It is absolutely naive of you to not consider the plight of the tradesman who may initially work or train under an uninsured sub.


Even though I disagree with your position you were stating your point in a good manner until this post. So being honest is somehow some kind of political position? What you seem to be saying is its ok to be dishonest as long as it benefits you. As I said before that is what is partially wrong with America.

You sir nor anyone thinking like you will ever work at any one of my job sites. On my last remodel a sub I had used in the past said he was sending Mexicans to do the gutters instead of the previous crew he had sent. I asked if they were legal and he said yes. I said that is OK as long as they speak English and show me their green card. He said they did not have too show their card, I said they do if you want the job. Well the original crew from the last job showed and did a great job. I demand that legal Americans work at my job sites and that the contractor provides a copy of his business license and insurance.
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:


Throughout our lives on this planet, there may arise times when it is appropriate to be dishonest.


Sorry got to disagree there. Think outside the box, push the envelope, set new trends, let er rip, but being dishonest. forget it. A man is judged in this world by doing what he says he going to do. My mentor taught me that rule 25 years ago. He said "even if it costs you money-do what you said you would do and you'll never go hungry". Guess what, he was right! I earned a pretty good living by following that advice.


quote:
No it will not, because I will never be litigated. I have carried liability & workmans's comp for over 5 years now.


Sorry friend, but just having the coverage is not going to keep you from being sued. There's no insurance that can keep that from happening and if you are engaging in acts such as you described you might want to go back and read the terms of your coverage.

quote:
You sir are the relic who needs to wake up. You are a jobsite antique who will soon be replaced and forgotten by younger men who do things quicker and better.


BAHAAAAWAAAAAAA, now that's funny. You were kidding right? The old adage, young, dumb and full of..... well you should know the rest, is still alive and well. Oh sure there are exceptions to the rule but expierence wins out in the long run. I want people on my job sites that have "been there done that".

quote:
It is absolutely naive of you to not consider the plight of the tradesman who may initially work or train under an uninsured sub.


Yeah, then the rest of us have to untrain them. Sorry again friend. It's been my expierence that sub's without the coverage give a better price because they can't compete with quality so they have to under cut the sub's with the coverage to get the job. That was a lesson I learned the hard way. I should of listened to momma when she said "if you want cheap you're gonna get cheap". Besides if they are willing to cut that corner then what other corners are they willing to cut? Think about that for a minute. In the end they are not paying for the insurance-it's me the client that pays for it.
quote:
Originally posted by HIFLYER:
Even though I disagree with your position you were stating your point in a good manner until this post. So being honest is somehow some kind of political position? What you seem to be saying is its ok to be dishonest as long as it benefits you. As I said before that is what is partially wrong with America.


Being dishonest has and never will be a routine part of my life BUT extreme measures can call for extreme actions. And i believe that life or death injuries fall into the category of being extreme. When it comes to one's life or the financial well-being and stability of one's family, I would put nothing past anyone. Would you risk not getting treated for injuries or racking up a large medical suit judgment against you just to be noble and good. For what?.... warm fuzzy feelings?

The fact that you are willing to go around a jobsite checking for greencards seems to hint at the fact that contracting may not be your primary employment or source of income.



quote:
Originally posted by uwsoftball: BAHAAAAWAAAAAAA, now that's funny. You were kidding right? The old adage, young, dumb and full of..... well you should know the rest, is still alive and well. Oh sure there are exceptions to the rule but expierence wins out in the long run. I want people on my job sites that have "been there done that".


No slope changes quicker than that of building materials and techniques. In the past 50 years, we have gone from brick veneer, to vinyl, and now to products like Hardie board and even wilder "green" building products. The chemical treatment and fastener specs for treated lumber seems to change almost annually. New products come onto the market constantly. Composite wood products, cellulose insulation (do you have to vent an attic when applying? Tell me quickly. Don't know do you?), new adhesives, specialty tools that cut installation time in half, etc.

Do you keep an aircard and laptop in your worktruck. How do you have instant access to code revisions, manufacturers installation instructions, appliance specs, houseplans? You're not still riding around with half a dozen rolled up plans on your dashboard are you?

What two type of fasteners are approved for ACQ treated lumber? How do you know if you are even using ACQ?

Tell me what you know about ceramic shower systems. What kind of vapor/moisture barrier works best? Do you prefer the roll on rubber or do you like the orange felt paper stuff that comes from Schluter. Do you embed your backer board in the wet mud of the pan (possibly wicking moisture) or do you hang it after the pan dries (leaving a gap and hanging everything on the integrity of your pan liner)?

What are the specs on joist spacing when running composite decking at 45 degree angle?

What is the approved method for attatchment of iron balusters to oak treads and handrail? The IRC just changed the maximum rise on residential stairways. What is it? Did you know anything had changed?, or are you just doing things a certain way because "that's the way we've always done it".

What is the appropriate way of attaching ledger boards to stucco and vinyl?

Do you still use T-molds? You have to right? Please tell me you don't.

Tell me about the tax credits for making your home more energy efficient.


These are just a few things i could think of. Things are changing constantly. While the same building principles apply like always, it is the attention to detail and compliance with manufacturer specs that insure the homeowner is in the position to make claim on warranty if ever needed.

The next generation of tradesmen will have better tools, easier access to critical information, and better marketing skills to upsell the homeowner.
Workmans Comp starts if you have 5 or more total employees. You don't have to carry WC if you (the owner) have three employees plus yourself. The moment you have that forth employee plus the owner you have to carry WC. The owner does not have to count his salary in the total payroll amount that is calculated to get the employers WC rate but if you have 4 or more employees plus the owner they want your money!
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by HIFLYER:
Even though I disagree with your position you were stating your point in a good manner until this post. So being honest is somehow some kind of political position? What you seem to be saying is its ok to be dishonest as long as it benefits you. As I said before that is what is partially wrong with America.


Being dishonest has and never will be a routine part of my life BUT extreme measures can call for extreme actions. And i believe that life or death injuries fall into the category of being extreme. When it comes to one's life or the financial well-being and stability of one's family, I would put nothing past anyone. Would you risk not getting treated for injuries or racking up a large medical suit judgment against you just to be noble and good. For what?.... warm fuzzy feelings?

The fact that you are willing to go around a job site checking for green cards seems to hint at the fact that contracting may not be your primary employment or source of income.

I never said contracting was my main employment, I am a airline pilot. I worked my way through college in the building trades and was building/remodeling just a couple of high end homes a year around Pickwick Lake before the market turned. It does not matter if I am the homeowner or contractor it is wrong and illegal to hire illegal people. I was able to make good money by providing a good product and honoring my word. Funny my brother in law is a construction superintendent for a big multi state firm and he has to ensure that the workers on his site are legal and have insurance.
I'm not fake at all. I have been exposed to all levels of job experience and am proud to say I have earned everything I accomplished.
Maynard, in reference to your post noting my age, I have many years of contracting left and intend to make many more improvements along the way. When I am too old for work, I have the next generation to take over behind me. I will never tell someone to dishonest!
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:
quote:
Originally posted by unclegus:
I'm not fake at all.


I think you are most likely legit. It's the other two who are presenting themselves as something they are not.

Just because you had a house built and subbed it out yourself, does not make you a contractor. I believe that HIFLYER and uwsoftball fall directly into this category.


I have a business license and do a lot of the work myself. I am sure you drive every nail and pull every wire. Go ahead with your dishonest attitude. I never said it provided my main income now. I simply said lying was wrong and you should have the appropriate licenses.
HIFLYER you have admitted that you are not a contractor. Answer any one of the questions I asked earlier and prove me wrong.

quote:
Originally posted by HIFLYER:
Go ahead with your dishonest attitude.


I don't think a dishonest attitude would have gotten me where I am today. I honor my word and protect my reputation at all costs, even if that occasionally means losing a dollar.

It is much easier to re-earn money than it is to rebuild my reputation.

And in regards to the continued accusations of me being dishonest, I continue to stand on my original platform. And that is..... In certain instances of jobsite injury on residential construction, the injured may be better off telling the hospital that they did it at home. Especially if they have separate health insurance.

Now if I had to guess, I would gander that upwards of 75% of the labor force on residential jobsites does NOT have any type of medical insurance. So if this number is accurate, it seems kind of odd that a 25% rate of insured would even raise this kind of debate on this issue. Why could this be??

I will tell you. Telling the hospital you did it at home is kind of an unspoken rule. I have known people who worked for folks who carried WC and still told the hospital they did it at home. WHY? There is one simple reason..... Drugs. The majority (not all) of tradesmen may take a toke or a pain pill every once in a while. Any WC involved injury treated at the ER will involve a drug screening. If the results come back positive, WC will not pay... and one other thing..... they lose their job.

Do you honestly think that there is a roofing crew in Cobert or Lauderdale County that could collectively pass a drug test? I would bet my life savings that there is not. It's not right, and you guys can sit here and say sh!t like "Those kind of people have never and will never be on my jobsite." But they are. And there is nothing you can do about it but contend with it. And seeing as every building has a roof, I would bet that one of those crews has been on your site. Not to mention painters....but they are not quite as bad.

You are blindly ignorant if you think that every soul that sets foot on any jobsite could pass a drug test.
quote:
Originally posted by Maynard J. Keenan:
HIFLYER you have admitted that you are not a contractor. Answer any one of the questions I asked earlier and prove me wrong.

quote:
Originally posted by HIFLYER:
Go ahead with your dishonest attitude.


I don't think a dishonest attitude would have gotten me where I am today. I honor my word and protect my reputation at all costs, even if that occasionally means losing a dollar.

It is much easier to re-earn money than it is to rebuild my reputation.

And in regards to the continued accusations of me being dishonest, I continue to stand on my original platform. And that is..... In certain instances of job site injury on residential construction, the injured may be better off telling the hospital that they did it at home. Especially if they have separate health insurance.

Now if I had to guess, I would gander that upwards of 75% of the labor force on residential jobsites does NOT have any type of medical insurance. So if this number is accurate, it seems kind of odd that a 25% rate of insured would even raise this kind of debate on this issue. Why could this be??

I will tell you. Telling the hospital you did it at home is kind of an unspoken rule. I have known people who worked for folks who carried WC and still told the hospital they did it at home. WHY? There is one simple reason..... Drugs. The majority (not all) of tradesmen may take a toke or a pain pill every once in a while. Any WC involved injury treated at the ER will involve a drug screening. If the results come back positive, WC will not pay... and one other thing..... they lose their job.

Do you honestly think that there is a roofing crew in Cobert or Lauderdale County that could collectively pass a drug test? I would bet my life savings that there is not. It's not right, and you guys can sit here and say sh!t like "Those kind of people have never and will never be on my jobsite." But they are. And there is nothing you can do about it but contend with it. And seeing as every building has a roof, I would bet that one of those crews has been on your site. Not to mention painters....but they are not quite as bad.

You are blindly ignorant if you think that every soul that sets foot on any jobsite could pass a drug test.


My experience is painters are the worst but mileage may vary. I actually have a good roofer "Metal". While I think you are right about individual insurance coverage in the trades that does not make it right. As I said, I have not built or remodeled anything for anyone since the market turned. I got lucky and sold my last one on Pickwick in 08. I live on Pickwick and the maket was great 2004-08 but now it is dead. My last Remodler magazine was exclusively devoted to green building and tax rebates. http://www.remodeling.hw.net/

I never said I was a full time contractor, I said I do it part time per say and only hire subs with proof of insurance and legal right to work in the U.S.
Sorry friend, but I did see where taking your test and passing it would equate to the ability to apply the knowledge needed to pass said test. That was the point earlier right? We were talking about actually doing the job not taking tests. I've seen plenty of people that can pass tests but not have the skill set required to actually perform the work and I've seen guys with great skills that can't pass tests.

Let's just agree to disagree on that point.

Nor do I think that I accused you of being dishonest. Disagreed with a statement you made-yes, accused you being dishonest, no. Sorry, I'm not aware that we've have had any dealings together to base such a judgement on. If I inferred that in any way-you have my apology.

And no, I do not work in construction any longer. Got lucky about about 15 years ago and moved on, however, I'm still active in development. My statement about having to retrain should have stated "as a client, I now pay" or "when I worked construction". No excuse-quick posting and left out details. Although my last statement should have cleared that up-where I stated "me the client", but that doesn't mean I haven't done the job.

Once again let's just agree to disagree.

Now your last point that you made about drugs on the jobsite. A very good point! One that you should have made earlier.

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