Skip to main content

Somewhere today, or most likely several somewheres, innocent people who trust their ministers were lied to about Creationism.  They were lied to about a 6000 year old Earth, Adam and Eve and Original Sin, dinosaurs walking among people, and Noah's Flood.

 

What have you done recently to challenge these obvious and harmful lies?

 

DF

Make time for great justice.  Expect us.

Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Originally Posted by Not Shallow Not Slim:

Somewhere today, or most likely several somewheres, innocent people who trust their ministers were lied to about Creationism.  They were lied to about a 6000 year old Earth, Adam and Eve and Original Sin, dinosaurs walking among people, and Noah's Flood.

 

What have you done recently to challenge these obvious and harmful lies?

 

DF

Wow... What a blanket statement! The type that normally trigger my distrust bone...I won't ask you to prove that because I realize that proving a negative is impossible. I will, however, ask you to provide us with just a bit of evidence to support your claim.

"obvious and harmful lies". How so? What makes them obvious and why are they harmful?

And before you try to get around the answer and turnfesta to a rant-fest, I'll tell you my feelings.

I strongly believe in the Creation. However, I believe also there there has been considerable evolution. This is not a black and white question. There is a middle ground. Science goes a long way in support of evolution. Yet most scientist have a strong belief in the Bible and the creation. Must we always have a my way or the highway stance on these issues that are worthy of discussion?  Science and Christian beliefs are not mutually exclusive!

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Yet most scientist have a strong belief in the Bible and the creation. 


------------

Uh, no they don't.

--------------------

There you go again! Respond to a reasoned post which asks a reasoned question with a k-off unsupported answer. In other words, avoid the question... Have we become so uncivilized as to find ourselves incapable of social discourse? Sad!

 

There I go again? It's a false statement on your part. You said most scientists have a strong belief in the bible and the creation. That is NOT true. I know that's not true. Where's your support for your statement that they do? What question did you ask that I'm avoiding?  What's "uncivilized" about disagreeing with your erroneous statement? 

Last edited by Bestworking
Today, a century and a half after Charles Darwin published "On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection," the overwhelming majority of scientists in the United States accept Darwinian evolution as the basis for understanding how life on Earth developed. But although evolutionary theory is often portrayed as antithetical to religion, it has not destroyed the religious faith of the scientific community. According to a survey of members of the American Assn. for the Advancement of Science, conducted by the Pew Research Center in May and June this year, a majority of scientists (51%) say they believe in God or a higher power, while 41% say they do not. LA times dec 2009

Sorry, that's not correct. AND by scientists find one that is made up of real scientists, not the ones that work in areas that have nothing to do with the study of the earth such as hydralics etc. The last one I saw had believers at around11% and their area of "science" had nothing to do with the study of the earth or anything related to evolution.

Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:
Originally Posted by Not Shallow Not Slim:

 

Jen, the question (I frequently make the mistake of assuming that the respondent read the entire post before responding):

.... I won't ask you to prove that because I realize that proving a negative is impossible. I will, however, ask you to provide us with just a bit of evidence to support your claim.

"obvious and harmful lies". How so? What makes them obvious and why are they harmful?

 

And now, I won't be so rude as to ask you what proof you have that most scientist are believers in Christ and therefore believers in creation. I will answer you, however, with a phd in the earth sciences.

Originally Posted by vplee123:
Today, a century and a half after Charles Darwin published "On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection," the overwhelming majority of scientists in the United States accept Darwinian evolution as the basis for understanding how life on Earth developed. But although evolutionary theory is often portrayed as antithetical to religion, it has not destroyed the religious faith of the scientific community. According to a survey of members of the American Assn. for the Advancement of Science, conducted by the Pew Research Center in May and June this year, a majority of scientists (51%) say they believe in God or a higher power, while 41% say they do not. LA times dec 2009
-----------------------
Thanks Veep... I'm very close to one of them. And don't let that earth sciences thing throw you. The fact is true across the board... I don't like to make blanket claims without the data to back up my claims as some do. It is really sad when we can't have a civil discussion without someone going off the deep end... For a long time it was simply Bill boy... Perhaps it's contagious... We all need to be reminded that this is a religious forum for which to discuss our beliefs, not force them down the throats of others... 
Yes I agree : it is sad that there is no civility. What I find most sad also is that the "atheist"population seems to equate atheism with a higher level of intelligence. There is no "dumbing down" required to have faith, and, as you said, science and faith do not need to be mutually exclusive. In fact, as the LA times study reported, they're not.
Originally Posted by Bestworking:

You were posting those questions to NSNS and you know it. He was the one that posted those statements. Good bye vega/buffalo/sixpack. And again, scientists that believe in the bible and creation are NOT scientists that work in the area pertaining to evolution.

 

Oh? Have we now narrow it down to evolutionary scientists? Or will you accept a phd in physical and analytical chemistry as being in the earth sciences?

Originally Posted by vplee123:
Jen 1. How do you know the LA times is not correct? 2. Why are you so "against" people having faith? What does it gain for you?

=============

I'm not against people believing, I'm against misinformation.  I have seen studies before, from the science sites myself, when this has been claimed before. And the scientists that believe are not scientists involved in the study of the earth. They are in areas that have nothing at all to do with it. BTW, dove is buffalo.

Originally Posted by vplee123:
Yes I agree : it is sad that there is no civility. What I find most sad also is that the "atheist"population seems to equate atheism with a higher level of intelligence. There is no "dumbing down" required to have faith, and, as you said, science and faith do not need to be mutually exclusive. In fact, as the LA times study reported, they're not.

==============

I have enough intelligence to not take a person's word for something when I've seen and read enough to know differently, and as posted before, when this claim about all the scientists that "believed" came up before, I did my own search. It's just not true.

Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:
Originally Posted by Not Shallow Not Slim:

Somewhere today, or most likely several somewheres, innocent people who trust their ministers were lied to about Creationism.  They were lied to about a 6000 year old Earth, Adam and Eve and Original Sin, dinosaurs walking among people, and Noah's Flood.

 

What have you done recently to challenge these obvious and harmful lies?

 

DF

Wow... What a blanket statement! The type that normally trigger my distrust bone...I won't ask you to prove that because I realize that proving a negative is impossible. I will, however, ask you to provide us with just a bit of evidence to support your claim.

"obvious and harmful lies". How so? What makes them obvious and why are they harmful?

And before you try to get around the answer and turnfesta to a rant-fest, I'll tell you my feelings.

I strongly believe in the Creation. However, I believe also there there has been considerable evolution. This is not a black and white question. There is a middle ground. Science goes a long way in support of evolution. Yet most scientist have a strong belief in the Bible and the creation. Must we always have a my way or the highway stance on these issues that are worthy of discussion?  Science and Christian beliefs are not mutually exclusive!

There is no middle ground.  Usually, either one believes in the Poof Theory of Creation or the standard scientific model.  I'll admit the standard scientific model is probably not 100% correct, but the Poof Theory is probably not .0001% correct.  The difference is, the standard scientific model craves correction, while the Poof Theorists lie about and distorts the faintest scientific question as proof that their superstition is correct.  The Poof Theorists start with an answer and fabricate "evidence" to support it.  It is inhuman and despicable in its very premise.

 

I don't give two shirts about your phd in Earth Sciences or whatever.  In fact, I don't believe you.  You have a phd in Earth Sciences like I have a phd in Banana Slug Psychology.  I await your credentials.

 

The obvious and harmful lies that Creationists submit include the rejection of every branch of science that exists.  It is an anti-scientific, anti-intellectual, pro-superstition stance that will retard the common education of an entire generation of Americans to our profound disadvantage, and I resent it as a progressive American.

 

How dare you present Creationism as anything other than ancient myth?  Have you no decency?

 

DF

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Oh hush buffalo, you don't know how to have a civil discussion.

LOL!!!! Jen, you have your head so far in dark places that you have no idea how far off base you are when you believe in the remote possibility that I might be buffalo/vega. If I didn't know that was coming from anger. Vega, on the other hand, might be a bit upset... LOL

Originally Posted by vplee123:
Jen 1. How do you know the LA times is not correct? 2. Why are you so "against" people having faith? What does it gain for you?
------------------------
Not to worry Veep... She's just gone off the deep end a few times this weekend... And no, Veep, I'm not Buffalo or any of those others.  I'm just Dove...:-)
Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:
Not to worry Veep... She's just gone off the deep end a few times this weekend... And no, Veep, I'm not Buffalo or any of those others.  I'm just Dove...:-)

________

You sure do have the characteristics of buffalo, & his way of talking. Especially in your treatment of Jenn the last few days. I don't normally accuse people of being someone else but there's some things you just can't ignore. I guess we wait & see, time will tell.

Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:

DF,

 

Two words define the difference - Science vs. Faith... The two are not mutually exclusive. The scientist deals with the sciences when s/he goes about his/her practice... When s/he turns to God he/she applies his/her faith... Simple as that. And I answer only to God (and occasionally my spouse).

*********************************

 

Would you say you are a Christian or just a believer in God? See, I think that there are some Scientist that would say they believed in a higher power, a God if you will, but if you ask them if they believed the bible to be literal then you would get a different answer.

 

Know what I mean?

Please allow me to clarify an impression I created that I personally had a phd. I said that, rather a poor choice of words, in response to a question about my sources - I said I'd answer the question with a phd in the earth sciences... I am very close to that has one. I definately am not a phd.. My apologies for the wrong impression.. 

Originally Posted by vplee123:
Hmm weird. Semi, I did not pick up on dove having a buffalo/rram-esque personality/writing style;-)

________

I didn't pick up on it until Dove started ridiculing Jenn for an opinion Dove didn't agree with. There's some statements Dove has said that is the same statement vega/buffalo made before he was banned. I may be wrong, so I guess we will have to wait & see for sure.

 

 

Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:

Please allow me to clarify an impression I created that I personally had a phd. I said that, rather a poor choice of words, in response to a question about my sources - I said I'd answer the question with a phd in the earth sciences... I am very close to that has one. I definately am not a phd.. My apologies for the wrong impression.. 

================

Uh huh. Bet you are "close".

Originally Posted by Jankinonya:
Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:

DF,

*********************************

 

Would you say you are a Christian or just a believer in God? See, I think that there are some Scientist that would say they believed in a higher power, a God if you will, but if you ask them if they believed the bible to be literal then you would get a different answer.

 

Know what I mean?

--------------------------------

 

I do. I consider myself a strong Christian and, of course, that includes a belief in God. One cannot be one without the other - The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit. That faith is between me an God... Now with regard to the Bible - I read it, I study it, when I have a question regarding it I seek out a more learned person than I for assistance. Recently I have had the good fortune to have someone readily available for such assistance in understanding. However, any sensible individual knows that the scripture has undergone a multitude of translations. I do not blindly assume that I have, myself, translated what I read. It all comes down to Faith. I place my faith in Christ and ask His guidance, knowing that He controls my very existence.

Originally Posted by Bestworking:
Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:

Please allow me to clarify an impression I created that I personally had a phd. I said that, rather a poor choice of words, in response to a question about my sources - I said I'd answer the question with a phd in the earth sciences... I am very close to that has one. I definately am not a phd.. My apologies for the wrong impression.. 

================

Uh huh. Bet you are "close".

----------------------------

Blood related.

And I am not any of those with whom you associate me!

You seem a bit paranoid...

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:
Originally Posted by vplee123:
Hmm weird. Semi, I did not pick up on dove having a buffalo/rram-esque personality/writing style;-)

________

I didn't pick up on it until Dove started ridiculing Jenn for an opinion Dove didn't agree with. There's some statements Dove has said that is the same statement vega/buffalo made before he was banned. I may be wrong, so I guess we will have to wait & see for sure.

 

 ------------------------

Trust me Semi, I have never even visited a forum before joining here... Bear with me and you'll see that I'm truthful. I very much dislike those who pretend what they are not.

 

Originally Posted by Not Shallow Not Slim:

Somewhere today, or most likely several somewheres, innocent people who trust their ministers were lied to about Creationism.  They were lied to about a 6000 year old Earth, Adam and Eve and Original Sin, dinosaurs walking among people, and Noah's Flood.

 

What have you done recently to challenge these obvious and harmful lies?

 

DF

============

I predict a new topic being created about this topic, coming soon.

Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:

Please allow me to clarify an impression I created that I personally had a phd. I said that, rather a poor choice of words, in response to a question about my sources - I said I'd answer the question with a phd in the earth sciences... I am very close to that has one. I definately am not a phd.. My apologies for the wrong impression.. 

Thanks, Dove.  And, truth be told, I really don't have a pHD in Banana Slug psychology.

 

DF

Add Reply

Post

Untitled Document
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×