Originally Posted by DarkAngel:
<Snipped for Brevity and to reduce amount of space needed > NOTE -- I Wil Reply within text with BLUE TEXT.
GBRK replied --> That is incorrect. Archeology has not done such. Sodom and Gomorra was dismissed as fable but i a recent History/National Geographic program I saw where archeologist have found what they fully believe, with a high degree of accuracy, is Sodom. The same for many other cities or locations. If you don't want to believe it I'm sure you have your reasons however it's not genuine to make such statements that are incorrect in order to justify your disbelief. Even if Archeology has not found something doesn't mean it didn't or does not exist anyone can realize that.
What does Sodom have to do with what DF posted? He was speaking on Moses and the supposed exodus. There is no evidence to back up the story in the bible. None. The Egyptians were meticulous in their record keeping. Not one mention of the great exodus can be found. Nothing about plagues. The only place you can find such things is in the bible.
Whether an ancient city existed is one thing. A story told in the bible about that city is something else entirely.
DA, What Sodom had to do with what DF posted is ... nothing. The reason I injected Sodom into the discussion is that many "experts" considered that Sodom and Gomorra never existed as well as the story of Lot and their destruction, equivalent to DF stating what he did about Moses and the escape into Egypt. There are many things mentioned in the Bible that Archeological evidence cannot be found but then later on such evidence is located. That happend in the case of Sodom as a new HGTV/History etc show broadcast about. Same with Atlantis in that for years people thought it to be a fable until it was found.
Many things are taken on Faith without evidence ... that's what faith is about. That's the only reason I brought Sodom into the equation. BTW .. the program also indicated that the cities met with immediate disaster (from archeological evidence) that killed all the inhabitants at once just like depicted in the Biblical story. They may never find evidence to reinforce, one way or the other, Biblical stories but just as there is NO evidence to support the stories there is NONE to refute them. One additional comment. Another program I viewed (I can't remember the name/title or channel, but I mostly watch History & Nat geo) did indicate some evidence that would prove a large group of people wandering in the desert as was told of the nation of Israel. There is documentation that a large population of Israel was under bondage or inhabited parts of Egypt then disappeared and appeared in Israel later. How did they get there? I know you and DF reject it but I do believe the Bible as to how this happened ... by FAITH.
Also I hope you have that same attitude in the next discussion on Evolution that you had in the above Bold statement. I could be wrong but I was thinking you have made statements that without "the missing link" evolution is false. I may be mixing you up with Bill and if I am then I apologize profusely.
I fully admit that I cannot accept the theory of Evolution based on many things and not tied to Religion or my belief in God. One of the primary problems I have with Evolution, as a vehicle by which all life species got here is not as much with the "missing link" type evidence from fossil records but add to that non-existant contemporary living incremental transitional evidence. IF Evolution is unintelligent there is no way it knows it has evolved and reached advanced stages for the original primary elements and components said to begin life (in every species) exist today in parts of the world as well as a environment that would promote the same type evolving as was said to have happened over millions of years. These primary elements are there and the advanced stages are there yet where are the various incremental transitional states at? Not in fossils but alive, existing, today for us to see and analyze?
We have 100% monkeys and 100% human but we don't see, living, walking or crawling around 10% monkey 90% human along with interspecies communication abilities. There should be (If Evolution is true) in every life species, existing today, incremental transitional beings so that there doesn't have to be someone piecing bones together trying to make some big jigsaw puzzle fit their theory. Never mind working out explaining the male/female conception and reproduction process and how that fits nicely into evolution.
The simple (at least to me as it's my personal belief) is that a great many evolutional scientist have to grab onto some GODLESS form of explanation of how all species of Life got here because they refuse to believe in God or some other Intelligent origin. Frankly I believe it takes more faith to accept evolution as the process all of this got here with all the problems that it introduces as to believe, by faith, that a deity or Intelligent Source was responsible.
Forget, also, about injecting DNA into the equation as is it too wild to assume that if all life was created that the creator would have used some common processes or that there would be some common elements in all life forms or species? Are we Humans trying to tell the Creator how He should create us? None of us can, beyond doubt, prove to the other the precise and definite vehicle by which all species of life got here. It also is a matter of Faith. Faith on the part of the individual as to what they believe and accept of what they are taught, told, or read.
To pronounce something totally unprovable and factual only demonstrates and reveals their own inadequacies and limitations. Christians, most that is, accept God as the source of Creation however there are some Christians that believe soundly in Evolution but believe that is the process which GOD USED. I frankly believe the exact process that GOD used will never be proved or known as I believe it's beyond the understanding or comprehension of humankind. I personally believe that all life, of every species, sprang from God's mind created from the Spiritual realm into a Physical Realm. Humankind I believe to be a very unique and special creation of God in that we have a soul/spirit that is, or can be, eternal and lives on past physical death of the body which serves as a container of that inner soul/spirit. Animals, Fish, Insects, Plant life, bacteria etc I do not believe were endowed with an inner spirit/soul which I fully believe God created. Every physical/fleshly creation is a product of flesh/physical source as in parents. The soul/spirit however I view as created of and by God and endowed within Human life setting us apart from all other creation making us special.
To view otherwise is to reduce man/woman/humankind to the exact same standing as any other life so IF SO why not exact the same laws for killing of animals, fish, plants, insects as they are life also? NO I don't believe evolution is the vehicle by which all life species became and got where they are today! I fully believe, with all confidence, that there is and was a Creator way more advanced and intelligent, powerful than we can conceive or understand.