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Scroll down to the third page on this link and read about the Pima County, Arizona Republican Party's raffle of a Glock pistol:

 

http://www.pimagop.org/files/e...gust%2026%202011.pdf

 

Now read about what the LAW in Arizona says about raffles and see if you can find ANYTHING that would make this GOP raffle legal:

 

http://www.gambling-law-us.com/State-Laws/Arizona/

 

"13-3302. Exclusions

A. The following conduct is not unlawful under this chapter:

1. Amusement gambling.

2. Social gambling.

3. Regulated gambling if the gambling is conducted in accordance with the statutes, rules or orders governing the gambling.

4. Gambling that is conducted at state, county or district fairs and that complies with section 13-3301, paragraph 1, subdivision (d).

B. An organization that has qualified for an exemption from taxation of income under section 43-1201, paragraph 1, 2, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10 or 11 may conduct a raffle....."

 

Here is that section.  See if you can find an exemption for political parties (Hint: it ain't there):

 

http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/43/01201.htm

 

 

Still not convinced?

See what the attorney general of Arizona says about raffles:

 

http://www.azag.gov/consumer/gambling/FAQ.html

 

An illegal raffle is a Class 5 FELONY, according to the attorney general.

 

Maybe someone in Pima County should call the sheriff and maybe the sheriff should investigate and if he finds that this raffle is illegal, maybe he should shut it down and report it to the attorney general!

I yam what I yam and that's all I yam--but it is enough!

Original Post

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I have an idea...why don't you look for the most obscure, non-issue, most-people-could-give-a-rats-a**  LESS story...devote maniacal time and energy on researching it...post references that have nothing to do with the issue...then, slap a sensational header on it...and be a "contedah" in the running for "Most Asinine Post of the Week".

But WAIT!  You just did!...

It took me about two minutes to research the post and determine the exception.  Contedah should stick to what he knows -- grammar.

 

As background, the Republicans purchased the pistol and planned the raffle many months ago.  The raffle is held in Congresswoman Gifford's district.  The Democrat Party, aka the party of permanent outrage, need to take their crying towels and go home.

 

Contendah,

If you truly believe in this, I suggest you go to Pima county and complain to the sheriff's department.  You will discover at least three things -- that Arizona has laws against trying to have someone arrested for a non-existent crime, a law against wasting an LEOs time  and that the sheriff is a Repubican. 

 

Originally Posted by interventor1212:

Obviously, as the proceeds go to a non-profit political organization, to do so (not allow the lottery) would be a violation of first amendment rights.  Non-profits such as St . Joseph's hospital are allowed. It is paragraph 4 in section 43-1201, cited in my original post

 

http://www.healthwealthraffle.org/index.php

 

*****

 

Time for you to start paying attention before you engage your keyboard to produce ignorance.

HERE is the legal exception in Arizona law that allows the St. Joseph's lottery.  It is paragraph 4 in section 43-1201, cited in my original post:

 

"4. Corporations organized and operated exclusively for religious, charitable, scientific, literary or educational purposes or for the prevention of cruelty to children or animals, no part of the net earnings of which inures to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual, and no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation."

 

That is the only exception that comes anywhere near allowing any raffles for a political organization, and it does not come anywhere near close enough to cover the GOP Glock raffle. In fact, the latter port of it clearly would bar a political party from conducting a raffle, since political parties do, in fact, carry on propaganda and attempt to influence legislation.

 

Your assertion that the conduct of a raffle is somehow protected under the First Amendment is simply too absurd to deserve any response.  If you really believe that the first amendment confers this right, you need to 'splain why.  I await breathlessly.

Originally Posted by interventor1212:

It took me about two minutes to research the post and determine the exception.  Contedah should stick to what he knows -- grammar.

 

As background, the Republicans purchased the pistol and planned the raffle many months ago.  The raffle is held in Congresswoman Gifford's district.  The Democrat Party, aka the party of permanent outrage, need to take their crying towels and go home.

 

Contendah,

If you truly believe in this, I suggest you go to Pima county and complain to the sheriff's department.  You will discover at least three things -- that Arizona has laws against trying to have someone arrested for a non-existent crime, a law against wasting an LEOs time  and that the sheriff is a Repubican. 

 

****

Having further researched the issue, I have learned that  jurisdiction in this matter lies with the Tucson Police Department and I am in ongoing communication with them 

"4. Corporations organized and operated exclusively for religious, charitable, scientific, literary or educational purposes or for the prevention of cruelty to children or animals, no part of the net earnings of which inures to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual, and no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation."

 

Contendah,

You provided my argument.  Political activities such as the Republican party's organization are usually registered as non-profit corporations.  Their activities are usually defined as educational -- political education.  Several federal court decision define this as free speech under the First amendment.  
Good luck with the Tucson PD, I'm sure their crank call handlers will enjoy your calls.

Originally Posted by interventor1212:

"4. Corporations organized and operated exclusively for religious, charitable, scientific, literary or educational purposes or for the prevention of cruelty to children or animals, no part of the net earnings of which inures to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual, and no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation."

 

Contendah,

You provided my argument.  Political activities such as the Republican party's organization are usually registered as non-profit corporations.  Their activities are usually defined as educational -- political education.  Several federal court decision define this as free speech under the First amendment.  
Good luck with the Tucson PD, I'm sure their crank call handlers will enjoy your calls.

*****

 

Read paragraph 4 again, interventor, and read it carefully this time.  Pay particular attention to the word, "exclusively."  Then tell me if you can honestly conclude that the "exclusive" purpose of the Pima County GOP is "education."

 

 According to numerous news releases, the proceeds from the raffle are to be used in conjunction with GOP "Get Out the Vote" activities.  One can reasonably suppose that propaganda dissiminated during a GOP "Get Out the Vote" activity will contain some pretty strong elements bthat go beyond mere any "educational" content.  Beyond this, it is inconceivable that the entirety of the  Pima County GOP's  activities are dedicated "exclusively" to education.  That is a legislative test the GOP will not be able to meet.  

 

Words mean a lot in the law, interventor. As with this issue, a single word can hugely change the scope and applicability of the law.

 

Your knee-jerk, top-of-the-head, out-of-thin-air comments are decidedly NOT "educational."

 

Originally Posted by skippy delepepper:

It just amazes me how none of these socialists can read.

Some how the language in the US Constitution is foreign to them.

Skippy

****************

 

It just amazes me how often you place bald, unsupported statements on this forum without submitting anything whatsoever of substance or analytical merit to back them up.  of 

Originally Posted by Contendah:
Originally Posted by skippy delepepper:

It just amazes me how none of these socialists can read.

Some how the language in the US Constitution is foreign to them.

Skippy

****************

 

It just amazes me how often you place bald, unsupported statements on this forum without submitting anything whatsoever of substance or analytical merit to back them up.  of 

_________________________________________________

Do yourself and the rest of us a favor.

Read it:

http://www.archives.gov/exhibi...s/constitution.htmlm

Skippy

Originally Posted by Contendah:
Originally Posted by interventor1212:

"4. Corporations organized and operated exclusively for religious, charitable, scientific, literary or educational purposes or for the prevention of cruelty to children or animals, no part of the net earnings of which inures to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual, and no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation."

 

Contendah,

You provided my argument.  Political activities such as the Republican party's organization are usually registered as non-profit corporations.  Their activities are usually defined as educational -- political education.  Several federal court decision define this as free speech under the First amendment.  
Good luck with the Tucson PD, I'm sure their crank call handlers will enjoy your calls.

*****

 

Read paragraph 4 again, interventor, and read it carefully this time.  Pay particular attention to the word, "exclusively."  Then tell me if you can honestly conclude that the "exclusive" purpose of the Pima County GOP is "education."

 

 According to numerous news releases, the proceeds from the raffle are to be used in conjunction with GOP "Get Out the Vote" activities.  One can reasonably suppose that propaganda dissiminated during a GOP "Get Out the Vote" activity will contain some pretty strong elements bthat go beyond mere any "educational" content.  Beyond this, it is inconceivable that the entirety of the  Pima County GOP's  activities are dedicated "exclusively" to education.  That is a legislative test the GOP will not be able to meet.  

 

Words mean a lot in the law, interventor. As with this issue, a single word can hugely change the scope and applicability of the law.

 

Your knee-jerk, top-of-the-head, out-of-thin-air comments are decidedly NOT "educational."

 

Contendah,

 

I'm unsure if your vitriolic comments are the result of partisanship or ignorance.  For decades, both parties have used their funds under the guise of education.  Its a well established political ploy in law and practice.  As to get out the vote activities, those are allowed as non-partisan activities, even if political party members drive the voter to the polls.  My comments are the results of years of observing the activities of both parties.

 

Frankly, I think you've lost it -- two misspelled word and resorting to deflective comments.  Its that, or demagoguery.  Take your pick!

If the raffle is illegal, the sheriff and the county prosecutors need to be recalled; the Pima County GOP has been doing these raffles for some time now. In fact, the Glock is a holdover from last year's raffle and a deer rifle is being added for the new raffle. 

Shaw said the Glock was an unclaimed prize from last year. He also noted that past gun raffles have been effective fundraisers and that responsible gun ownership is a constitutional right.

http://ktar.com/category/local...P-fundraiser-raffle/

I suspect that one reason for the left's outrage besides the fact that a Glock was used by a protected psychopath (Mom worked for the county!) is because a large part of the Dem's constituency misuse guns (and cars, drugs, English language, etc.) 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VMXisuDWGw

Originally Posted by skippy delepepper:
Originally Posted by Contendah:
Originally Posted by skippy delepepper:

It just amazes me how none of these socialists can read.

Some how the language in the US Constitution is foreign to them.

Skippy

****************

 

It just amazes me how often you place bald, unsupported statements on this forum without submitting anything whatsoever of substance or analytical merit to back them up.  of 

_________________________________________________

Do yourself and the rest of us a favor.

Read it:

http://www.archives.gov/exhibi...s/constitution.htmlm

Skippy

****

 

Listen up, Mormon:

 

If you read what I posted above, you will find links to official sources that support what I posted.  Then look at your own posts in this string and find NOTHING but your unsupported opinion.

 

Do yourself a favor and get some education on a subject before posting your useless opinion on it.

Originally Posted by interventor1212:
Originally Posted by Contendah:
Originally Posted by interventor1212:

"4. Corporations organized and operated exclusively for religious, charitable, scientific, literary or educational purposes or for the prevention of cruelty to children or animals, no part of the net earnings of which inures to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual, and no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation."

 

Contendah,

You provided my argument.  Political activities such as the Republican party's organization are usually registered as non-profit corporations.  Their activities are usually defined as educational -- political education.  Several federal court decision define this as free speech under the First amendment.  
Good luck with the Tucson PD, I'm sure their crank call handlers will enjoy your calls.

*****

 

Read paragraph 4 again, interventor, and read it carefully this time.  Pay particular attention to the word, "exclusively."  Then tell me if you can honestly conclude that the "exclusive" purpose of the Pima County GOP is "education."

 

 According to numerous news releases, the proceeds from the raffle are to be used in conjunction with GOP "Get Out the Vote" activities.  One can reasonably suppose that propaganda dissiminated during a GOP "Get Out the Vote" activity will contain some pretty strong elements bthat go beyond mere any "educational" content.  Beyond this, it is inconceivable that the entirety of the  Pima County GOP's  activities are dedicated "exclusively" to education.  That is a legislative test the GOP will not be able to meet.  

 

Words mean a lot in the law, interventor. As with this issue, a single word can hugely change the scope and applicability of the law.

 

Your knee-jerk, top-of-the-head, out-of-thin-air comments are decidedly NOT "educational."

 

Contendah,

 

I'm unsure if your vitriolic comments are the result of partisanship or ignorance.  For decades, both parties have used their funds under the guise of education.  Its a well established political ploy in law and practice.  As to get out the vote activities, those are allowed as non-partisan activities, even if political party members drive the voter to the polls.  My comments are the results of years of observing the activities of both parties.

 

Frankly, I think you've lost it -- two misspelled word and resorting to deflective comments.  Its that, or demagoguery.  Take your pick!

****

 

You still seem not to understand what "exclusively" means.  More likely you just ignored that part of my post in your vain effort to rescue your position.  That word was carefully selected in crafting the Arizona legislation.  It means that only an organization that is EXCLUSIVELY educational can qualify for the exemption.  Now, explain how the Pima County GOP or any other  political party can credibly claim to be "exclusively" educational.

 

And while you are attempting that impossible task, kindly explain the relationship between the raffle and the First Amendment.   And explain. along with that. why any raffle or lottery could possibly be banned if they are protected by the First Amendment.

After spending at least 90 seconds reading the law, it appears to me that the status of the GOP is not extremely relevant to the ability to hold a raffle.  Some organizations are exempt, ie churches and charities, from registering the raffle with the state, but any organization can have a raffle if they jump through a few extra hoops and file all the paperwork. 

Contendah:

"You still seem not to understand what "exclusively" means.  More likely you just ignored that part of my post in your vain effort to rescue your position.  That word was carefully selected in crafting the Arizona legislation.  It means that only an organization that is EXCLUSIVELY educational can qualify for the exemption.  Now, explain how the Pima County GOP or any other  political party can credibly claim to be "exclusively" educational.

 

And while you are attempting that impossible task, kindly explain the relationship between the raffle and the First Amendment.   And explain. along with that. why any raffle or lottery could possibly be banned if they are protected by the First Amendment."

 

The party organization is a non-profit corporation.  Its purpose is to educate about Republican candidates, of which getting them elected is an nice byproduct..  That is all that's needed to justify their ability to hold a raffle.  My point on the first amendment is that political speech is protected under the first amendment, including any educational aspect.  As the Republicans have held the raffles for years without prosecution, I suspect my points are accepted by the Arizona state prosecutors. 

 

Have fund with the Tucson PD.  By now, I'm sure their crank file on you is growing. 

 

Ditzy,

 

Contendah and your legal barracks lawyer opinions, with 5 cents would have purchased a cup of coffee in 1955.

Arizona Law

Unless you are a tax-exempt organization as recognized under A.R.S. §43-1201, paragraphs 1, 2, 4, 5 ,6, 7, 10, or 11, you may not conduct a raffle or any other form of amusement gambling unless the event is registered with and approved by the Arizona Attorney General's Office, 1275 West Washington Street, Phoenix, AZ 85007, 602.542.3881. To register, you must complete a written Amusement Gambling and Raffle Registration Form for approval by the Attorney General's Office. (ARS §13-3311) If you are a tax-exempt organization as recognized under A.R.S. §42-1201, paragraphs 1, 2, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, or 11, then you do not need to register with the Arizona Attorney General's Office but you still have to meet the conditions of A.R.S. 13-3302, B.




STATE OF ARIZONA
OFFICE OF THE ATTORNEY GENERAL
SPECIAL INVESTIGATIONS SECTION
AMUSEMENT GAMBLING AND RAFFLE REGISTRATION FORM

 

http://www.azag.gov/consumer/regtest.pdf

 


 

I dont think fund raising is a First Amendment issue, but feel free to post a link to a case on point that identifies a governmental restriction of a controlled activity purposely used against a political party as an attempt to quell free speech

Originally Posted by interventor1212:

Please post an instance where Arizona has prosecuted a political party for holding a raffle.  I've read rant after rant by the two of you and nothing of any prosecution.

***********

 

This may be a first, interventor.  The exemptions for raffles at Arizona Revised Statutes 4301201 are described in the Attorney General's web site (link provided in my original post) as "[r]ecently enacted amendments."  Thus, your argument that "....the Republicans have held the raffles for years without prosecution,"  whether true or not, has no bearing on the issue of whether their CURRENT lottery is legal.

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