quote:Verse 5:45 points out clearly that everyone on Earth will be treated alike.
When?
When?
When?
Exactly. I ask once why anyone would even want another life. Streets paved with gold. Think about that. Why would there be streets paved with gold? And mansions, can't forget about those mansions.quote:Originally posted by Road Puppy:quote:Originally posted by JimiHendrix:
Still waiting for something other than delusional babbling. Why do people believe in something for which there is zero evidence? Very, very strange.
Know why? I think I do.
Most people can't deal very well with the fact that life is quick, time is short and dead is dead.
Hence all the stories of angels and streets paved with gold and such stuff.
Maybe for a lotta folks-life'd be kinda pointless if it just ended like I believe it does.
Personally I live every day as hard as I can -cuz tomorrow might not come.
Mark 10:25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
ask anybody else who you believe to be a Christian what they think it says, I know you will trash me, but you being an Athiest I know my word means nothing to you. I care not what you think.
Then who the heck were you posting to? You don't "love" anyone that doesn't believe like you do.quote:Originally posted by prince albert:
ask anybody else who you believe to be a Christian what they think it says, I know you will trash me, but you being an Athiest I know my word means nothing to you. I care not what you think.
quote:Originally posted by buffalo:
And crust darling, just so you don’t waste our time on here with any argument; be advised it takes about sixty hours of relentless lecture to explain any of the leading scientific theories. Sixty hours crust and that doesn’t include discussion. Sixty hours crust sixty hours. The math itself will separate all but a tiny fraction from a clue as to the truth of the matter. That tiny fraction then has to rely on several admitted assumptions so you amateur reckoners are at a decided disadvantage and don’t need to be on here posing as neck-beard apologists.
Always remember, the buffalo can spot BS at an incredible distance.
As I've said before it wernt Poof the Majik Dragon.
I don't need sixty hours, or even sixty words, to tell you that the universe wasn't poofed into existence in six days.
You state that if I'm to present any explanation, that I need to bring my proof. Back atcha - bring yours. We all anxiously await the charts and graphs and stuff. Bill will be impressed, I'm sure.
Buf, pal, you don't know me well enough to call me "darling"; and if you did, you wouldn't.
Fair enough crust dear, you’re correct I don’t know you.quote:Originally posted by CrustyMac:quote:Originally posted by buffalo:
And crust darling, just so you don’t waste our time on here with any argument; be advised it takes about sixty hours of relentless lecture to explain any of the leading scientific theories. Sixty hours crust and that doesn’t include discussion. Sixty hours crust sixty hours. The math itself will separate all but a tiny fraction from a clue as to the truth of the matter. That tiny fraction then has to rely on several admitted assumptions so you amateur reckoners are at a decided disadvantage and don’t need to be on here posing as neck-beard apologists.
Always remember, the buffalo can spot BS at an incredible distance.
As I've said before it wernt Poof the Majik Dragon.
I don't need sixty hours, or even sixty words, to tell you that the universe wasn't poofed into existence in six days.
You state that if I'm to present any explanation, that I need to bring my proof. Back atcha - bring yours. We all anxiously await the charts and graphs and stuff. Bill will be impressed, I'm sure.
Buf, pal, you don't know me well enough to call me "darling"; and if you did, you wouldn't.
I’m agreeing “the heavens declare the glory of God”.
If you disagree with the fundamental view it can only be through speculation on your part.
Let me remind you; your first hand knowledge can only be a few decades.
God gave us the 6k package with instructions to easily wrap our mind around.
It is concise, workable and user friendly.
You see; the challenge I made to you will go unanswered and for good reason; few can comprehend the scientific alternatives and those that do at some point must resort to some measure of hand-waving to accept any of them as proof.
The big bang is not the only alternate but simply the one most convenient as the proof of it is so involved and as Plato would say “invention” those that do not understand will blame the inability on their own misfortune.
I know crust you are not going to offer proof because of your misfortune .
You see I have followed many of these sixty hour lectures and I know the truth of the matter.
The 6k package with instructions is sufficient as there are many other tasks at hand that should occupy the mind of the common people. I guess the most important one is to feed themselves.
No matter which path you choose; it will be on faith alone.
Puff the magic dragon was indeed childish; like something deep would say. Please address me with more sophistication.
quote:Originally posted by Jennifer:Exactly. I ask once why anyone would even want another life. Streets paved with gold. Think about that. Why would there be streets paved with gold? And mansions, can't forget about those mansions.quote:Originally posted by Road Puppy:quote:Originally posted by JimiHendrix:
Still waiting for something other than delusional babbling. Why do people believe in something for which there is zero evidence? Very, very strange.
Know why? I think I do.
Most people can't deal very well with the fact that life is quick, time is short and dead is dead.
Hence all the stories of angels and streets paved with gold and such stuff.
Maybe for a lotta folks-life'd be kinda pointless if it just ended like I believe it does.
Personally I live every day as hard as I can -cuz tomorrow might not come.
Mark 10:25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
Yet more proof that "Jennifer" knows nothing about the Bible. No wonder she became an atheist! If she studied the Bible as she claims, and misunderstood it as this post shows, she either wasn't bright enough to understand what she read, or she is lying about having studied it at all.
If you take that verse in CONTEXT, you will see that the REASON Jesus said it is hard for the rich to get to Heaven is that their riches are more important to them than God.
21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. “One thing you lack,” he said. “Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
22 At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.
23 Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God!”
24 The disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said again, “Children, how hard it is[e] to enter the kingdom of God! 25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
quote:Originally posted by O No!:
If you take that verse in CONTEXT, you will see that the REASON Jesus said it is hard for the rich to get to Heaven is that their riches are more important to them than God.
21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. “One thing you lack,” he said. “Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
22 At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.
23 Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God!”
24 The disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said again, “Children, how hard it is[e] to enter the kingdom of God! 25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
Ah. The Jim and Tammy Bakker PTL club method.
Uh-huh.
quote:Originally posted by O No!:quote:Originally posted by JimiHendrix:
Still waiting for something other than delusional babbling. Why do people believe in something for which there is zero evidence? Very, very strange.
Jimi, we have TOLD you why we believe without evidence. I told you there will NEVER be "evidence" because God wants our love through faith and not through evidence. And Gbrk wrote some beautiful posts on the subject.
Can you give me evidence for love? No, you can't, because there IS no evidence for love. So I guess love doesn't exist either, and if you've ever loved someone YOU must be delusional.
So, we have answered your question. You may not like the answer, but we HAVE answered it, and although we know we haven't changed your mind, please rest assured that you will never change ours either.
More babbling. No answer. The question was about evidence, not feelings. You have admitted that there is no evidence. I accept that. Move on.
quote:Originally posted by gbrk:
First of all thank you (O & V) for your kind words about my post. It's often difficult for believers who God has blessed with His Holy Spirit to relate to unbelievers that which is undeniable within them, the Power of God that can bring and change a person from the inside and immediately. When a person refuses to consider or allow the possibility of a Spiritual realm apart from the Physical, which is there for us to see and touch, then it becomes an impossibility to convey to that person the magnitude of what we experience in Christ. They are looking for black and white two dimensional facts and evidence and want to restrict everything to just that.
This is how you come up with theories such as the "Big Bang" or Evolution. When you discount a dimension apart from the Physical that is before our eyes then you have to come up with ways that a human can understand to explain that which at times is unexplainable. Jimi can no more convince people he has dreams or what they are so, as you have said, they must not exist since you cannot physically prove them.
Non-believers are very similar, in their approach to things, as those that once believed that the world was flat. They base their decisions only on that which they can touch or see and cannot envision that maybe, just maybe, there is a realm or world apart from what they can personally touch and feel. You can only share that which you personally can attest to and leave it at that. If they blindly go, so sure they are right, denying God's existence and not caring to seek for God then they assume upon themselves the weight and results of that decision and they can live happy knowing they are right.
We can pray for our friends, loved ones and ourselves and be willing to share that which we have been blessed with and in doing that we fulfill our responsibilities for the blessings we have been given. Hopefully one day those that do not know God will have opportunity to meet God and only then will they become Spiritually enlightened. Until then they will always remain in a two dimensional reality.
This is just idiotic.
quote:Originally posted by gbrk:
NSNS wrotequote:Love could be a universal experience, except among the very rare emotionally damaged, and therefor needs no proof. Such as the sensation of heat. No one needs to prove to you that a stovetop is painful.
Love is an emotion that we can experience. Dreams or thoughts or memories within the brain/mind likewise are things we cannot touch or feel yet exist. You say God is way different yet that is not so. The soul/spirit within a man/woman is also something that is debated and argued as to if it even exist but I believe it does and is one thing that is significant about being human and sets us apart from all other life/creation. The flesh is a physical entity where the soul/spirit is a spiritual entity and each will go to it's own realm upon death. Can I prove it? No however it cannot be disproved either.
You say (most) everyone has love, experiences love and other emotions and senses and yet no proof is necessary. Well millions of believers also relate a very common thing among them, that being the sense of God's presence in the Holy Spirit that is within and dwells within their physical bodies along with their soul/spirits. The difference is not everyone has that experience as not everyone is blessed by God with that because no everyone has exercised their faith and belief in Christ.
No I can't prove it, it can't be disproven but to totally discount it because you don't feel it or haven't experienced it yourself is well like those who knew the world was flat.
Very poor reasoning. If you aren't going to answer the question, why do you keep posting?
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
Jefferson Hendrix,
The heavens declare the glory of God and the firmament shows his work.
Do you have a problem with that evidence?
The heavens declare the glory of God and the firmament shows his work.
Do you have a problem with that evidence?
Funny how they all talk about those mansions and streets of gold.
quote:Originally posted by O No!:
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
When you keep saying the same thing over and over and over, without answering the original question, that is babbling. You have admitted that you can't answer the question, so shut up, already. Start your own thread about love, if that concerns you.
I still haven't seen any proof that jimi has a brain.
Anyone?
Anyone?quote:This is how you come up with theories such as the "Big Bang" or Evolution. When you discount a dimension apart from the Physical that is before our eyes then you have to come up with ways that a human can understand to explain that which at times is unexplainable. Jimi can no more convince people he has dreams or what they are so, as you have said, they must not exist since you cannot physically prove them.
The Big Bang and evolution are the result of scientific observations and study. No supernatural dimension is necessary.
Religion is precisely that mechanism that humans use to explain the inexplicable. Until quite recently, it was all we had, and therefor understandable. But now we know about the Big Bang, evolution, seismology, etc. and there is no honest reason to reject those studies in favor of our previous ignorance.
nsns
quote:Religion is precisely that mechanism that humans use to explain the inexplicable
Deep, I'm glad you finally see the light.
quote:Originally posted by O No!:
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
ono, science has shown that "love" consists of chemical reactions in the brain. a little oxytocin, endorphins and other opioids here, a few pheromones there, a natural tendency to prefer symmetry over chaos (beauty), subconscious desires to procreate with the individual who best represents our "ideal" choice of gene propogation. all these purely physical manifestations of the innate need to reproduce combine to form the complicated concept we call "love" and i'm sure other animals species have a "word" for it, too.
whether you like or not, whether you choose to participate or not, your sole purpose in life is to pass on your genetic information. we are but containers for genes.
it's a perfectly natural phenoenon. no magic sky men necessary.
scientifically inaccutate uno on everything you stated as fact in your post. Making you look stupid. Quit with trying to be a scientist.quote:Originally posted by Unobtanium:quote:Originally posted by O No!:
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
ono, science has shown that "love" consists of chemical reactions in the brain. a little oxytocin, endorphins and other opioids here, a few pheromones there, a natural tendency to prefer symmetry over chaos (beauty), subconscious desires to procreate with the individual who best represents our "ideal" choice of gene propogation. all these purely physical manifestations of the innate need to reproduce combine to form the complicated concept we call "love" and i'm sure other animals species have a "word" for it, too.
whether you like or not, whether you choose to participate or not, your sole purpose in life is to pass on your genetic information. we are but containers for genes.
it's a perfectly natural phenoenon. no magic sky men necessary.
quote:Originally posted by buffalo:scientifically inaccutate uno on everything you stated as fact in your post. Making you look stupid. Quit with trying to be a scientist.quote:Originally posted by Unobtanium:quote:Originally posted by O No!:
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
ono, science has shown that "love" consists of chemical reactions in the brain. a little oxytocin, endorphins and other opioids here, a few pheromones there, a natural tendency to prefer symmetry over chaos (beauty), subconscious desires to procreate with the individual who best represents our "ideal" choice of gene propogation. all these purely physical manifestations of the innate need to reproduce combine to form the complicated concept we call "love" and i'm sure other animals species have a "word" for it, too.
whether you like or not, whether you choose to participate or not, your sole purpose in life is to pass on your genetic information. we are but containers for genes.
it's a perfectly natural phenoenon. no magic sky men necessary.
I are wannabe inaccutate, tooooooo!
Dang scientists!
quote:Originally posted by O No!:
Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
Being loved by someone even during those times we're not lovable.
Semi, I find it hard to believe there is a time you are not lovable. 
quote:Originally posted by JimiHendrix:
I would really like to see some evidence for the existence of God. I am not looking for what you "feel" or "believe" but some real evidence. I don't believe that there is any evidence. Someone please prove me wrong.
Here is your original post, Jimi. There IS no question, just an assertion that there is no evidence for God.
I agreed with you. YOU think there is no evidence because He does not exist. I told you there is no evidence because He wants our love through faith, and not through evidence.
So we have both concluded there will never be evidence, although for different reasons. And yet you posted this:
JimiHendrix
Everybody Knows My Name
Posted 20 April 2011 11:23 PM Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by O No!:
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
"When you keep saying the same thing over and over and over, without answering the original question, that is babbling. You have admitted that you can't answer the question, so shut up, already. Start your own thread about love, if that concerns you."
Again, There IS no original question. I have not ADMITTED I can't answer the question because there WAS no question. Only an assertion that I agreed with. I think that it is YOU who is babbling!
quote:Originally posted by semiannualchick:quote:Originally posted by O No!:
Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
Being loved by someone even during those times we're not lovable.
First of all, Semi, I agree with Blue - you are a fine person who deserves to be loved no matter what you say or do.
And although your answer is not based on real evidence, it is fine with me. God also loves us, even when we don't consider ourselves "lovable". That's just the way true friends are.
quote:Originally posted by buffalo:scientifically inaccutate uno on everything you stated as fact in your post. Making you look stupid. Quit with trying to be a scientist.quote:Originally posted by Unobtanium:quote:Originally posted by O No!:
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
ono, science has shown that "love" consists of chemical reactions in the brain. a little oxytocin, endorphins and other opioids here, a few pheromones there, a natural tendency to prefer symmetry over chaos (beauty), subconscious desires to procreate with the individual who best represents our "ideal" choice of gene propogation. all these purely physical manifestations of the innate need to reproduce combine to form the complicated concept we call "love" and i'm sure other animals species have a "word" for it, too.
whether you like or not, whether you choose to participate or not, your sole purpose in life is to pass on your genetic information. we are but containers for genes.
it's a perfectly natural phenoenon. no magic sky men necessary.
What exactly do you think is inaccurate (if that is what you meant to say)?
There is also proof that our sense of smell helps us pick a mate and the more suited we are physically the more likely we are to have feelings of "love".
quote:sez blue: Semi, I find it hard to believe there is a time you are not lovable.
God...I just spewed the monitor...
quote:ono, science has shown that "love" consists of chemical reactions in the brain. a little oxytocin, endorphins and other opioids here, a few pheromones there, a natural tendency to prefer symmetry over chaos (beauty), subconscious desires to procreate with the individual who best represents our "ideal" choice of gene propogation. all these purely physical manifestations of the innate need to reproduce combine to form the complicated concept we call "love" and i'm sure other animals species have a "word" for it, too.
whether you like or not, whether you choose to participate or not, your sole purpose in life is to pass on your genetic information. we are but containers for genes.
it's a perfectly natural phenoenon. no magic sky men necessary.
Sounds great, now explain the homosexual person.
quote:Originally posted by O No!:quote:Originally posted by JimiHendrix:
I would really like to see some evidence for the existence of God. I am not looking for what you "feel" or "believe" but some real evidence. I don't believe that there is any evidence. Someone please prove me wrong.
Here is your original post, Jimi. There IS no question, just an assertion that there is no evidence for God.
I agreed with you. YOU think there is no evidence because He does not exist. I told you there is no evidence because He wants our love through faith, and not through evidence.
So we have both concluded there will never be evidence, although for different reasons. And yet you posted this:
JimiHendrix
Everybody Knows My Name
Posted 20 April 2011 11:23 PM Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by O No!:
You asked for evidence. I told you WHY no one would ever be able to show you evidence. That isn't "babbling".
Now, could you answer MY question, please? Show me evidence (not feelings) for love.
"When you keep saying the same thing over and over and over, without answering the original question, that is babbling. You have admitted that you can't answer the question, so shut up, already. Start your own thread about love, if that concerns you."
Again, There IS no original question. I have not ADMITTED I can't answer the question because there WAS no question. Only an assertion that I agreed with. I think that it is YOU who is babbling!
Blah, blah, blah. OK, here is the question: what is the evidence for the existence of God? You have already answered it.
Come back when you have something new and coherent to say.
Hahahahaha.
quote:Originally posted by b50m:quote:ono, science has shown that "love" consists of chemical reactions in the brain. a little oxytocin, endorphins and other opioids here, a few pheromones there, a natural tendency to prefer symmetry over chaos (beauty), subconscious desires to procreate with the individual who best represents our "ideal" choice of gene propogation. all these purely physical manifestations of the innate need to reproduce combine to form the complicated concept we call "love" and i'm sure other animals species have a "word" for it, too.
whether you like or not, whether you choose to participate or not, your sole purpose in life is to pass on your genetic information. we are but containers for genes.
it's a perfectly natural phenoenon. no magic sky men necessary.
Sounds great, now explain the homosexual person.
the psychological tenancies of one gender with the physical attributes of another. also sometimes caused by traumatic experiences in early childhood. see? it's really quite simple. evolution is an imperfect, haphazard process that results only in tendencies that favor genetic propogation, not absolutes. unlike the "perfection" supposedly offered by the invisible creator in the sky.
now, would you care to explain homosexuality (found in most higher animals) from a christian perspective?
quote:Originally posted by Unobtanium:quote:Originally posted by b50m:quote:ono, science has shown that "love" consists of chemical reactions in the brain. a little oxytocin, endorphins and other opioids here, a few pheromones there, a natural tendency to prefer symmetry over chaos (beauty), subconscious desires to procreate with the individual who best represents our "ideal" choice of gene propogation. all these purely physical manifestations of the innate need to reproduce combine to form the complicated concept we call "love" and i'm sure other animals species have a "word" for it, too.
whether you like or not, whether you choose to participate or not, your sole purpose in life is to pass on your genetic information. we are but containers for genes.
it's a perfectly natural phenoenon. no magic sky men necessary.
Sounds great, now explain the homosexual person.
the psychological tenancies of one gender with the physical attributes of another. also sometimes caused by traumatic experiences in early childhood. see? it's really quite simple. evolution is an imperfect, haphazard process that results only in tendencies that favor genetic propogation, not absolutes. unlike the "perfection" supposedly offered by the invisible creator in the sky.
now, would you care to explain homosexuality (found in most higher animals) from a christian perspective?
Ooh, ooh, pick me! I have an answer to that one.
It is exactly as you state - there are some who are born that way, just as there are some born with cleft pallate, some with abusive parents, some with a propensity for acne, some with mental impairment, some with huge noses, some with no parents at all who wind up in orphanages, some with blindness, some with deafness, some with lousy voices, some with incurable B.O., some with fear of heights, some with...
And it is what we DO with the "crosses we have to bear" that matters.
quote:now, would you care to explain homosexuality (found in most higher animals) from a christian perspective?
Don't you know? They are going against GAWDDDDDDDDDDD. They CHOOSE to be homosexuals and bring down the wrath of all guuuddddddddd and decent people on their heads. LOL, and before someone jumps in with the "you're so angry" crap let me tell you right now I'm laughing at you. I can just "hear" the "fire and brimstone" answer to that question.
quote:the psychological tenancies of one gender with the physical attributes of another. also sometimes caused by traumatic experiences in early childhood. see?
You are saying they are NOT born that way? Your explanation is saying they feel like one but look like the other, that is transgender, not homosexual. Try again.
quote:Originally posted by Jennifer:quote:now, would you care to explain homosexuality (found in most higher animals) from a christian perspective?
Don't you know? They are going against GAWDDDDDDDDDDD. They CHOOSE to be homosexuals and bring down the wrath of all guuuddddddddd and decent people on their heads. LOL, and before someone jumps in with the "you're so angry" crap let me tell you right now I'm laughing at you. I can just "hear" the "fire and brimstone" answer to that question.
No, they don't choose. They are born that way.
quote:Originally posted by O No!:
I have an answer to that one. there are some who are born that way,
quote:Originally posted by b50m:
No, they don't choose. They are born that way.
The Bible says that God created man in his own image. It also says it is an abomination for a man to lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman. The same for women that has unnatural relations.
I find it hard to believe that God would create a human being to be a homosexual, then warn us against it & go so far as to call it an abomination.
According to you, I guess God created pedophiles, rapist, etc.
What these people are isn’t their own fault, they aren’t just simply mean people that is going to do what feels good no matter who gets hurt or dies by their hand. It’s because God created them that way.
No, Semi, what I'm saying is that God created us all and we ALL have something to deal with. It is not for humans to judge, that is God's job. Rapists and pedophiles HURT people and we make laws to protect the innocents that they hurt. Gays don't hurt anyone, and we humans should just stay out of it. If God wants to judge them that is His right.
And I ALSO believe that, as we are ALL sinners, but if we love Jesus we are saved, that the "sin" of homosexuality is no different from the sins ALL Christians commit. And if a Gay person loves Jesus, he or she too, will be saved.
And I ALSO believe that, as we are ALL sinners, but if we love Jesus we are saved, that the "sin" of homosexuality is no different from the sins ALL Christians commit. And if a Gay person loves Jesus, he or she too, will be saved.
quote:Originally posted by O No!:
No, Semi, what I'm saying is that God created us all and we ALL have something to deal with. It is not for humans to judge, that is God's job. Rapists and pedophiles HURT people and we make laws to protect the innocents that they hurt. Gays don't hurt anyone, and we humans should just stay out of it. If God wants to judge them that is His right.
And I ALSO believe that, as we are ALL sinners, but if we love Jesus we are saved, that the "sin" of homosexuality is no different from the sins ALL Christians commit. And if a Gay person loves Jesus, he or she too, will be saved.
I agree that it's not our place or right to judge those people. And that homosexuality is no different from any other sin.
But the question "would you care to explain homosexuality from a christian perspective?" I understood you to answer "there are some who are born that way".
That's why I said that I find it hard to believe that God would create a human being to be a homosexual, then warn us against it & go so far as to call it an abomination.
Yes, a gay person can love Jesus, the same as anyone else but if he/she lives a homosexual lifestyle, according to the Bible, not me, they won't go to Heaven.
Semi, the way I see it, there are a lot of people who are born with "problems". Take for example, a kid who is born to abusive parents. I have read about kids who underwent horrific abuse from the time they were born, who went on to become murderers.
But there are others who suffer the same abuse who, in spite of the odds, grow up to be good, productive people.
I THINK that God gives some people more trials to overcome than others. But I also think He throws them a lifeline, and it is up to them to choose whether or not to grab it.
I also think that if someone is born to such sorrows and overcomes them through faith, that their reward in Heaven will be great.
But I DON'T believe that someone living the homosexual lifestyle is automatically condemned to Hell. As I said, we are ALL sinners, and if He sent people who sin to Hell, we'd ALL be going there.
He sent Jesus BECAUSE none of us can keep from sinning. Some of us envy, some are disrespectful to our parents, some of us don't correct the cashier who gives us back too much change. (That IS stealing.) Most of us commit a variety of sins every day.
And because we are all sex driven creatures, a lot of us commit sins of a sexual nature. If God can forgive people for fornication (which He does if we ask Him to and believe in Him), I'm certain that He will also forgive anyone who lives a gay lifestyle.
Jesus told the prostitute to "Go and sin no more". But as she too was human, I'm sure she too sinned again. But she knew and loved Jesus, and I'm sure she is in Heaven right now.
But there are others who suffer the same abuse who, in spite of the odds, grow up to be good, productive people.
I THINK that God gives some people more trials to overcome than others. But I also think He throws them a lifeline, and it is up to them to choose whether or not to grab it.
I also think that if someone is born to such sorrows and overcomes them through faith, that their reward in Heaven will be great.
But I DON'T believe that someone living the homosexual lifestyle is automatically condemned to Hell. As I said, we are ALL sinners, and if He sent people who sin to Hell, we'd ALL be going there.
He sent Jesus BECAUSE none of us can keep from sinning. Some of us envy, some are disrespectful to our parents, some of us don't correct the cashier who gives us back too much change. (That IS stealing.) Most of us commit a variety of sins every day.
And because we are all sex driven creatures, a lot of us commit sins of a sexual nature. If God can forgive people for fornication (which He does if we ask Him to and believe in Him), I'm certain that He will also forgive anyone who lives a gay lifestyle.
Jesus told the prostitute to "Go and sin no more". But as she too was human, I'm sure she too sinned again. But she knew and loved Jesus, and I'm sure she is in Heaven right now.
I understand what you’re saying & this will get us nowhere so we can agree to disagree.
I still stand by my belief that I find it hard to believe that God would create a human being to be a homosexual, then warn us against it & go so far as to call it an abomination, & that person, living a homosexual lifestyle, still goes to Heaven when they die.
Yes, He can throw a lifeline, & it is up to the individual to choose whether to grab it or not but if that person chooses not to grab it, & continues to live the way they were warned against, I don't see how he/she can go to Heaven.
I can use myself as an example. I was saved many years ago, know it just as sure as I know that I’m sitting in front of my computer. If I were to die tomorrow, I would not go to Heaven. Why? Because I’m not living by the rules Jesus set up for us to live by.
I still stand by my belief that I find it hard to believe that God would create a human being to be a homosexual, then warn us against it & go so far as to call it an abomination, & that person, living a homosexual lifestyle, still goes to Heaven when they die.
Yes, He can throw a lifeline, & it is up to the individual to choose whether to grab it or not but if that person chooses not to grab it, & continues to live the way they were warned against, I don't see how he/she can go to Heaven.
I can use myself as an example. I was saved many years ago, know it just as sure as I know that I’m sitting in front of my computer. If I were to die tomorrow, I would not go to Heaven. Why? Because I’m not living by the rules Jesus set up for us to live by.