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Hi Bill, I just started this thread to make sure you read it since the "Wives in the bible" thread had grown to over 2 pages. Since you do not like to wade through the "spitting contest" as you call them, perhaps you can help me with the following taken from your post.

Quote:
For about 2500 years, there was no such restriction as we know incest today. However
we do know that the effect of interrelated marriages will eventually corrupt the gene pool --

From this explanation, are we to assume That there were no problems with genetics for 2500 years? That defies all medical and scientific possibilities. It's still incest however you try to slip and slide with your answer. Or does "eventually" equal 2500 years?

"I sure feel a lot more like I do now than when I first got here"

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quote:
Originally posted by paw-paw:
quote:
Originally posted by Bill Gray:
Paw suggests that this is incest. No, for God did not institute the law of incest until the time of Moses. For about 2500 years, there was no such restriction as we know incest today. However, we do know that the effect of interrelated marriages will eventually corrupt the gene pool -- so, God made changes in the way people married and had children. But, until the time of Moses -- no incest, no incest laws.

Hi Bill, I just started this thread to make sure you read it since the "Wives in the bible" thread had grown to over 2 pages. Since you do not like to wade through the "spitting contest" as you call them, perhaps you can help me with the following taken from your post.

From this explanation, are we to assume That there were no problems with genetics for 2500 years? That defies all medical and scientific possibilities. It's still incest however you try to slip and slide with your answer. Or does "eventually" equal 2500 years?

Hi Paw,

No, I never said that it did not eventually present a problem. I said that, until God gave the Law to Moses, there were no laws against siblings intermarrying. Since God began the creation of mankind with only one couple, there were not too many other options. Of course, God could have created two couples, Adam and Eve, Jack and Suzy, and then that would not have been a problem. However, for His own reasons God did not do it this way -- and who am I to argue with God?

Yet, God seeing that the intermarrying would lead to problems in the gene pool of humans -- put a stop to the intermarrying in the time of Moses. You might view this slow corruption of the gene pool like the person who, over a long period of time, is slowing ingesting small amounts of arsenic. Initially, it may not have any effect; but, then it begins to cause illnesses -- and, if not stopped and reversed, eventually the build up will cause death. God stopped the intermarrying and reversed the corruption of the human gene pool by giving Moses the Law which included laws against incest.

I pray that I have cleared up any confusion you may have had -- and that we are on the same page.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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quote:
Originally posted by paw-paw:
Bill, While I cannot agree with you, I thank you for your thoughts. It's just that all medical studies I have ever read don't support your claim. It's just one of those little areas of the bible that have always made me go hm-m-m-m. The logic path just will not compute.

Hi Paw,

Not sure what "studies" you mean -- for I am not aware of any which address the gene pool starting with Adam and Eve and subsequent generations. You are basing all your comments on generalities. Give us specifics to support your disbelief of what the Bible teaches. Statements with facts, with sources -- have impact. Statements which just speak in generalities have no impact at all.

What is it that you do not believe -- and what proof do you have? What is your valid reason for not believing the Bible?

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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quote:
Originally posted by Billy Joe Bob Gene:
Ben, where do you preach?

Hi Deep,

Ben is right where he can do a lot of good. Let's nominate him for our Anti-Atheist League Chairman. I have already seen and heard all of your Richard Dawkins ventriloquist act so many times, it has become boring. Maybe Ben, not having had his senses dulled by your atheist rhetoric -- can give us new insight.

Ben, we welcome you to our neighborhood. And, regardless of all the rocks you may see thrown on this Religion Forum -- keep in mind that the rock throwers are a small group -- and a lot of solid Christians live here.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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While I disagree with Bill about Adam and Eve being "THE ONLY HUMANS" God created, I'm with him on the rest. This is a perfect example of our finite minds trying to understand the un-understandable. Humans were created IMMORTAL!!! They were immortal until the first sin made them finite. Read Genisis closely and you'll see the absolute turmoil God is in through-out.
Read especially chapter 6... God is angry, seemingly at Himself, for ever creating man. He put the 120 year mark as the ceiling for life, He spoke of the wickedness of man and that man's "heart was only evil continually".. vs 6 says "And it repented the Lord that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him at His heart"... then comes the first destruction of life on earth.
There were a lot of changes following that flood folks... lot's of changes. Please don't be ignorant.. you can disagree and believe what you want, but if you are going to talk about the Bible, READ IT, and at least try to understand it. Even if you think it is a work of fiction, you should still try to understand what it is about.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter Rielly:
While I disagree with Bill about Adam and Eve being "THE ONLY HUMANS" God created, I'm with him on the rest.

Hi Peter,

While I agree with you that Adam and Eve are not the "only humans" that God created (He created all of us) -- but my statement was that He began His creation of man with only one couple, Adam and Eve:

Since God began the creation of mankind with only one couple, there were not too many other options. Of course, God could have created two couples, Adam and Eve, Jack and Suzy, and then that would not have been a problem. However, for His own reasons God did not do it this way -- and who am I to argue with God?

Do we agree on this -- or do you believe there was more than one couple initially created?

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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Actually BG.. I'm kinda torn. In the first chapter of Genesis verses 26 & 27 during the description of all things created, the wording strikes me when it gets to man...
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

His description of creating man is worded in the same way His description of creating all the other creatures of the world... Very generalized.

However, in chapter two, the creation of Adam is much more specific. Some translation actually have in verse 7.."the Lord God formed THE man from dust"... as if to point out that this particular man was seperate from vs 26 of Chapter one where it says "and God said, let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let THEM have dominion..."
And as we know, Adam is a direct decendent to Jesus... So, just my analytical thinking leads me to wonder if more weren't created, only the story of Adam and Eve were told in detail simply because of the relevance of their blood line. Also, the fact that when Cain is cast out, he is concerned about folks harming him for killing Able. Who are these folks, and where did they come from, or get where they were... Who is Cain's wife, and where did she come from?

So that's more my own thoughts... I've always been taught that Adam and Eve were first and only, but my own studies have lead me to other possible thoughts on the matter.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter Rielly:
Actually BG.. I'm kinda torn. In the first chapter of Genesis verses 26 & 27 during the description of all things created, the wording strikes me when it gets to man...
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

His description of creating man is worded in the same way His description of creating all the other creatures of the world... Very generalized.

However, in chapter two, the creation of Adam is much more specific. Some translation actually have in verse 7.."the Lord God formed THE man from dust"... as if to point out that this particular man was seperate from vs 26 of Chapter one where it says "and God said, let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let THEM have dominion..."
And as we know, Adam is a direct decendent to Jesus... So, just my analytical thinking leads me to wonder if more weren't created, only the story of Adam and Eve were told in detail simply because of the relevance of their blood line. Also, the fact that when Cain is cast out, he is concerned about folks harming him for killing Able. Who are these folks, and where did they come from, or get where they were... Who is Cain's wife, and where did she come from?

So that's more my own thoughts... I've always been taught that Adam and Eve were first and only, but my own studies have lead me to other possible thoughts on the matter.



peter,

I guess I'm not as torn as you are about this. I'll say that God created many
more men and women. I say this only because of incest, the gene pool and the
logic of God. Everyone doesn't have the same DNA.
Well Kraven... we are pretty close.. lol

Genesis 9:19
"These are the three sons of Noah: and of them was the whole earth overspread."

Shem, Ham, and Japeth were Noah's sons and the three of them along with their wives repopulated the earth... A pretty huge task which I think has been undervalued!!! lol... so there had to be some "kissin cousins" goin on from that. But God commanded them to repopulated the earth and that's what they did. Now, God made it pretty clear with Moses when he didn't want that to go on anymore. We hear often time that God is "never changing"... that is highly misleading... we don't make it through 6 chapters of the Bible before God makes a big change in his plan... he sees that the flesh has corrupted earth, as Chapter 6 vs 12 says.. "And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted His way upon the earth."
God took drastic steps many times to attempt to "fix" man-kind. He decided the only way was to give them a savior... THE ultimate sacrifice that would wash us clean in his eyes. Jesus Christ was that sacrifice, and God sees that perfect blood as our ticket to be with Him, the way He always desired, yet that we(mankind) were to wicked to allow to happen.

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