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Maybe it is just me, but I think I have figgered out Obama's stance on what we should do in Syria.
He set the marker with his "red line" statement, and now, to save international face, he has to do SOMETHING.

So, he ask Congress for authorization to strike Syria, knowing full well, that the Republicans in Congress are against everything he is for, and for everything he is against .
Therefore, the Congressional Republicans will not authorize a strike on Syria, and I think that is exactly what Obama wants.

However, if Congress does pass it, he can then place all the blame onto Congress, especially the House Republicans.

So, Is my logic flawed ?

(BTW, just for the record, I oppose intervention in Syria as long as it is contained within that country)

 

 

 

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“Attempting to debate with a person who has abandoned reason is like giving medicine to the dead.”
― Thomas Paine

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Don't care what Obama desires, its how he has harmed the nation's appearance to other nations that concerns me.  Drawing the red line a year ago set a marker, which the US must uphold, if its credibility is to survive.  Personally, I'm against attacking Syria, because  the US isn't directly affected and I'm concerned there are two many interlocking interests that may result in a much wider conflict.  Think the assassination of a noble in a small nation, in a shaky cobbled together empire which resulted in WWI.

All Republicans need to vote present and put the ball back in obama side. You are exactly right that obama is hoping that congress will vote no, then he can say I tried but congress would not let me. There is no reason at all for the U S to get involved in this. As far as the US needing to save face, I think all the other countries know how the people and congress, certainly the Republicans feels about obama's self interest.

Originally Posted by seeweed:

Aparantly Boner dosen't give a damm .  http://www.addictinginfo.org/2...-back-from-vacation/

jmmg, if house R's were to do that, they would be neglecting one of the major responsibilities they have been given by the Constitution, not that they care about the Constitution, they just hate Obama and any thing he tries to do .

 

________________________________________________________

Congress is scattered all over the world. It would take days to gather them back to DC.  If, its of such importance, then, Reid should call the Senate back immediately and start the debate. By then, the House would be back anyway.  It would be best for the Republicans to simply withhold their vote and let the Dems settle the mess and deliver the results to Obama.   Just heard Obama say it didn't matter if the delay was one day, one week, or one month.  So, if it doesn't matter to him, why should anyone else run around as if it mattered. 

Originally Posted by ribbit:

I wish (BUSH) had backed out of attacking Iraq. That is a disgrace we'll have to live with.  Blame it on congress or repubs democrats or whoever. Who cares long as we don't get ourselves mixed up any further than we already are...

I find myself in agreement Ribbit. Hopefully we as a country can get back to using the military only when we have serious national interests at stake and not trying to be the world's policeman or nanny.

Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by seeweed:

Aparantly Boner dosen't give a damm .  http://www.addictinginfo.org/2...-back-from-vacation/

jmmg, if house R's were to do that, they would be neglecting one of the major responsibilities they have been given by the Constitution, not that they care about the Constitution, they just hate Obama and any thing he tries to do .

 

________________________________________________________

Congress is scattered all over the world. It would take days to gather them back to DC.  If, its of such importance, then, Reid should call the Senate back immediately and start the debate. By then, the House would be back anyway.  It would be best for the Republicans to simply withhold their vote and let the Dems settle the mess and deliver the results to Obama.   Just heard Obama say it didn't matter if the delay was one day, one week, or one month.  So, if it doesn't matter to him, why should anyone else run around as if it mattered. 

=========

Then why was Boner demanding immediate reports to Congress from Obama. If it can wait, then it can wait.

Frankly, I once more state I hope we don't intervene. Korea, Vietnam, Kuwait/Iraq 1, Serbia, Afghanistan, Iraq 2 . Other than making a bunch of war contractors filthy rich, what did the United States actually gain from these experiences ?  (Oh, and I almost forgot that little island that Reagan invaded )

Originally Posted by seeweed:
Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by seeweed:

Aparantly Boner dosen't give a damm .  http://www.addictinginfo.org/2...-back-from-vacation/

jmmg, if house R's were to do that, they would be neglecting one of the major responsibilities they have been given by the Constitution, not that they care about the Constitution, they just hate Obama and any thing he tries to do .

 

________________________________________________________

Congress is scattered all over the world. It would take days to gather them back to DC.  If, its of such importance, then, Reid should call the Senate back immediately and start the debate. By then, the House would be back anyway.  It would be best for the Republicans to simply withhold their vote and let the Dems settle the mess and deliver the results to Obama.   Just heard Obama say it didn't matter if the delay was one day, one week, or one month.  So, if it doesn't matter to him, why should anyone else run around as if it mattered. 

=========

Then why was Boner demanding immediate reports to Congress from Obama. If it can wait, then it can wait.

Frankly, I once more state I hope we don't intervene. Korea, Vietnam, Kuwait/Iraq 1, Serbia, Afghanistan, Iraq 2 . Other than making a bunch of war contractors filthy rich, what did the United States actually gain from these experiences ?  (Oh, and I almost forgot that little island that Reagan invaded )

_____________________________________

Korea was justified.  South Korea is a democracy, wealth and prosperous.  The north is starving and lead by a succession of megalomaniacs.  Afghanistan was necessary to dislodge al Qaeda.  The Talib were given a chance to kick them out or turn them over.  They refused and suffered.  the consequences.  As a participant, I wish the war in Viet Nam had concluded differently.  Kicking the Iraqis out of Kuwait was necessary.

If we bomb something in Syria, what will it be?  For the last 30 years, we have done the wrong thing in the mideast every time except maybe one or two.

230 something marines got killed in a barracks and we ran.  That wasn't right.

We ran the Iraq invaiders out of Kuwait, maybe that was right.

We did something in Bosenia (? spelling), that might have worked out right.

We went to Afghanistan and didn't finish the job.  That wasn't right

We left Afghanistan and went to Iraq.  We didn't find biological weapons or chemical weapons or weapons of mass destruction.  Look what a nice condition we left Iraq in.

We went back to Afghanistan again, look what we have accomplished.

Now we want to bomb something in Syria.  

What we need to do is not advise Israel about anything and let them do as they see fit.

Originally Posted by jtdavis:

If we bomb something in Syria, what will it be?  For the last 30 years, we have done the wrong thing in the mideast every time except maybe one or two.

230 something marines got killed in a barracks and we ran.  That wasn't right.

We ran the Iraq invaiders out of Kuwait, maybe that was right.

We did something in Bosenia (? spelling), that might have worked out right.

We went to Afghanistan and didn't finish the job.  That wasn't right

We left Afghanistan and went to Iraq.  We didn't find biological weapons or chemical weapons or weapons of mass destruction.  Look what a nice condition we left Iraq in.

We went back to Afghanistan again, look what we have accomplished.

Now we want to bomb something in Syria.  

What we need to do is not advise Israel about anything and let them do as they see fit.

_______________________________________-

In a couple of hundred years, we may know if invading Iraq was the right thing.  The court is still out on the French revolution.  On most days, Baghdad is safer than Chicago.

Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:
In a couple of hundred years, we may know if invading Iraq was the right thing.  The court is still out on the French revolution.  On most days, Baghdad is safer than Chicago.

If that wasn't so true, it would actually be pretty funny. 

 

As for Syria - if we don't have the support of the UN and our allies, we need to shut the *%^& up and mind our own business.  Sure, its a humanitarian mess, but its a CIVIL WAR.  I understand the need to punish Assad to help ensure that the use of chemical weapons is unacceptable during any conflict, if the world does not support the action, then who are we to make the decision on our own? 

 

I do agree about the politics of the current decision.  It will be interesting to see how it plays out......

Originally Posted by jtdavis:

And do not forget, we armed the rebels in Afghanistan when Bin Lauden and company was fighting the Russians.  Think about what that got us. 

____________________________

We armed the rebels in Afghanistan, we did not arm Bin Laden, nor al Qaeda.  Bin Laden was mainly a Saudi money man, back then, providing funds to the rebels. Al Qaeda was a small group.  They only fought the Soviets once. 

Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by seeweed:
Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by seeweed:

Aparantly Boner dosen't give a damm .  http://www.addictinginfo.org/2...-back-from-vacation/

jmmg, if house R's were to do that, they would be neglecting one of the major responsibilities they have been given by the Constitution, not that they care about the Constitution, they just hate Obama and any thing he tries to do .

 

________________________________________________________

Congress is scattered all over the world. It would take days to gather them back to DC.  If, its of such importance, then, Reid should call the Senate back immediately and start the debate. By then, the House would be back anyway.  It would be best for the Republicans to simply withhold their vote and let the Dems settle the mess and deliver the results to Obama.   Just heard Obama say it didn't matter if the delay was one day, one week, or one month.  So, if it doesn't matter to him, why should anyone else run around as if it mattered. 

=========

Then why was Boner demanding immediate reports to Congress from Obama. If it can wait, then it can wait.

Frankly, I once more state I hope we don't intervene. Korea, Vietnam, Kuwait/Iraq 1, Serbia, Afghanistan, Iraq 2 . Other than making a bunch of war contractors filthy rich, what did the United States actually gain from these experiences ?  (Oh, and I almost forgot that little island that Reagan invaded )

_____________________________________

Korea was justified.  South Korea is a democracy, wealth and prosperous.  The north is starving and lead by a succession of megalomaniacs.  Afghanistan was necessary to dislodge al Qaeda.  The Talib were given a chance to kick them out or turn them over.  They refused and suffered.  the consequences.  As a participant, I wish the war in Viet Nam had concluded differently.  Kicking the Iraqis out of Kuwait was necessary.

========

we have not fought a "war" ( I use quotes because none were declared ) since WWll to win it.

We nowdays just fight for parity or whatever .

I believe you should not fight unless you intend to win , and then get Congress to declare WAR and then fight to win it. Do whatever it takes, even if it means killing all the men and selling the women and children into slavery. Fight to win.
None of the "conflicts" I listed above were ever fought to "win" , hell, even the "wars" in Bush's beloved Iraq , we rebuilt their roads, schools , and hospitals, and gave the people of Iraq free health care, and not all that much different in the "war" Bush forget in Afghanistan.
We need to be rebuilding our own infrastructure here, in this country. It's no wonder the rest of the industrialized world does so much more for their own citizens, like assuring they have health care. They ain't giving free health care to Iraq, Afghanistan and no telling what other places.

We spend our wealth and blood on war, other places spend their wealth on building their own countries and on families.

 

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