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I've been thinking about this for a while. It's one reason I said we needed an Atheist Forum so the christians wouldn't feel they were being attacked. The question for the atheists is what are some of the strange things you've heard a christian say? One thing I heard was when I visited a church for their "revival". They were "testifying" and one woman stood up and got into it pretty hard and heavy. She was going pretty good about how it's parents responsibility to raise their kids to love and know the lord, and at one point looked at her three children and said "I'd rather see my children dead than know I'd failed to bring them to god". Those poor kids, they were terrified. That has really stuck with me.
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quote:
I've been thinking about this for a while. It's one reason I said we needed an Atheist Forum so the christians wouldn't feel they were being attacked. The question for the atheists is what are some of the strange things you've heard a christian say? One thing I heard was when I visited a church for their "revival". They were "testifying" and one woman stood up and got into it pretty hard and heavy. She was going pretty good about how it's parents responsibility to raise their kids to love and know the lord, and at one point looked at her three children and said "I'd rather see my children dead than know I'd failed to bring them to god". Those poor kids, they were terrified. That has really stuck with me.


Then, I guess...as ALL religion does, they "handled rattlesnakes" and went into "hissyfits"...?
Ay?
quote:
Originally posted by vplee123:
what a terrible thing to say. especially to one's children.
Of course, as we have said numerous times before, there are crazy people everywhere.....it is not a trait that is exclusive to Christians.
Of course, but when you hear a christian say something like that it gets your attention. To their credit many many in the congregation "squirmed" and looked shocked. Like I said she was really getting into it. Do you know what testifying is? Does your church do that?
quote:
Originally posted by vplee123:
Nope- no testifying in the Catholic Church.
What a relief, too! lol! people are most often best spoken when they keep their mouths shut.

...as evidenced by this lady's "testimony".

Is testimony mandatory in some churches?
No it's not mandatory. And not all services have that part. Usually just during revivals. If someone feels moved to stand and "share or testify" they will. Easiest way to describe it is they give their own little "mini sermons". One goofy woman stood and said she was looking around and noticing how hot everyone was, and how they were "fanning" themselves, and if they thought it was hot now just think how hot hell would be. I think the whole place wanted to bytch slap her.
quote:
Originally posted by tigrtrek:
Yes I've been in many testifying services. They don't seem as popular as they were when I was a kid. That lady sounds like a loon. Most people just use their testimony as a way of praising God and relating experiences in their walk.
They may not be popular anymore because when they got started you could be trapped at church half the day. Wink Most churches just did it during revival. That's mostly when ours did unless someone felt the need before then.
quote:
They may not be popular anymore because when they got started you could be trapped at church half the day. Most churches just did it during revival. That's mostly when ours did unless someone felt the need before then.


god! I hope she has me on ignore!

My experiences, during revival, or most any other church service, were the "behind the building " chronicles.
Anatomy 101...Christian style.
I suppose, poor Jennifer...was never invited.
quote:
Originally posted by vplee123:
Nope- no testifying in the Catholic Church.
What a relief, too! lol! people are most often best spoken when they keep their mouths shut.

...as evidenced by this lady's "testimony".

Is testimony mandatory in some churches?


No testifying and no bible either. The Catholic church has hidden the gospel for 2000 years and one day they will pay for the great sins.
quote:
Originally posted by LoveShack:
quote:
Originally posted by vplee123:
Nope- no testifying in the Catholic Church.
What a relief, too! lol! people are most often best spoken when they keep their mouths shut.
...as evidenced by this lady's "testimony".
Is testimony mandatory in some churches?


No testifying and no bible either. The Catholic church has hidden the gospel for 2000 years and one day they will pay for the great sins.


---------------------------------------

"The greatest Ignorance is to reject something you know NOTHING about".

I don't remember who said that, but thats you loveshack.
quote:
Originally posted by vplee123:
Nope- no testifying in the Catholic Church.
What a relief, too! lol! people are most often best spoken when they keep their mouths shut.

...as evidenced by this lady's "testimony".

Is testimony mandatory in some churches?


quote:
Originally posted by LoveShack:
No testifying and no bible either. The Catholic church has hidden the gospel for 2000 years and one day they will pay for the great sins.


Say what????? Eeker

Testifying still goes on in many churches today.
There are those that do it with bible in hand
that will pay for those great sins, no matter what religion they are.
We have had complete services when people will give their testimonies. We've had a few when one person gave his/her testimony for the entire service. These type services are usually announced ahead of time and almost always result in a packed house, especially when the person sharing is one who was well-known as a drunk, drug addict, etc. before coming to Christ. We've never had anyone who got all "crazy" and said some stupid junk like the lady Jennifer quoted. Those morons in Kansas need to be taken out of everyone's misery. There are extremists in nearly every group who give the rest of that group a bad name. You just have to keep your eyes and ears open and you can't be afraid to leave a place when false doctrine is being taught, regardless of whether you're close to some people in the congregation. Whatever you believe, stand up for it!
quote:
We have had complete services when people will give their testimonies. We've had a few when one person gave his/her testimony for the entire service.

It wasn't my church, and it was a revival. It's been a while but seems like I remember revivals went on for a week? Not sure. AND you knew "testifying" was a part of it. Like I said, some of them could really get into it, like it was their chance to "preach".
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
I've been thinking about this for a while. It's one reason I said we needed an Atheist Forum so the christians wouldn't feel they were being attacked. The question for the atheists is what are some of the strange things you've heard a christian say? One thing I heard was when I visited a church for their "revival". They were "testifying" and one woman stood up and got into it pretty hard and heavy. She was going pretty good about how it's parents responsibility to raise their kids to love and know the lord, and at one point looked at her three children and said "I'd rather see my children dead than know I'd failed to bring them to god". Those poor kids, they were terrified. That has really stuck with me.


No one ever stated that there couldn't be idiot Christians just as their are idiot athiests. That woman was a moron. Morons come in all shapes, sizes, and spiritual beliefs/disbeliefs.
quote:
Originally posted by Tomme73:
We have had complete services when people will give their testimonies. We've had a few when one person gave his/her testimony for the entire service. These type services are usually announced ahead of time and almost always result in a packed house, especially when the person sharing is one who was well-known as a drunk, drug addict, etc. before coming to Christ.


I notice that that particular kind of thing is a recurring pattern among a lot of christians-especially 'mid-life' christians.

Some years ago I ran into an old acquaintance from the neighborhood who spent the better part of two hours explaining to me that I shouldn't be wasting my time fretting about this life I'm currently in the process of living. No, I should be working hard for the next one-the 'hereafter' where everything was going to be all better. This life, he said was just another trial on the way to paradise. (heaven).

His eyes got all glazed over when I asked him how he'd come to this conclusion-all he could say was that the bible had told him this.
When I asked him why he needed a bible so bad-he informed me that he had spent quite some time involved with drugs and booze and they had pretty much ruined his life and 'getting religion' was the only way he could save himself from guaranteed self-destruction.

Ah! Then there is the reason. He couldn't handle himself-to the point where he almost killed himself with his unchecked behavior.

He was one of those people who obviously DO need an instruction manual on how to live successfully apparently because he didn't have the ability or was just not strong enough to do so on his own.

I told him "Thanks, man. Glad that's workin' out for ya so well. Me? I think I'll just keep on doing what I do and see where I end up. I got a gut feeling that I'm gonna end up where everybody else does-either as worm food or more likely filler for the next road-repaving project. Meanwhile I don't think it's a good idea to waste one minute of the life I have worrying about where I'm going. I'll find out soon enough where that is. I'd like to try to do it right the first time as there may not be another chance."

As I said goodbye to him and was walking away I could hear him still preaching about repentance and all that other neato stuff.

Repent? For what? To whom?

Pfft.

I figure if I don't hurt people that don't deserve it on purpose and I don't purposely hurt myself-Then I've got nothing to feel guilty about and I don't have to spend any time looking over my shoulder-much less for the wrath of a vengeful deity.

Another christian approached me once as I was sitting in my car one morning waiting for my bus to warm up before starting my route.
I didn't know this woman at all. Out of the blue she starts with "Do you have Jesus in your heart?"

I didn't miss a beat and replied with "No, ma'am. He was gettin' kinda heavy. I now have him in the trunk."

She ran outta talent pretty quick and walked away.

An another thing.....I think that pretty much the next person that walks up to me after they've been talkin' smack about somebody else and tells me to 'have a blessed day' is only gonna make it about as far as the 'bl-' part before they're suddenly spitting chiclets and wondering what the hell just happened.

I'll have the kinda day I decide to, thanks. Wink
quote:
Another christian approached me once as I was sitting in my car one morning waiting for my bus to warm up before starting my route.
I didn't know this woman at all. Out of the blue she starts with "Do you have Jesus in your heart?"

I didn't miss a beat and replied with "No, ma'am. He was gettin' kinda heavy. I now have him in the trunk."


Puppy,

Regardless of my beliefs, that was funny! I got all misty-eyed from it. Thanks!
Road Puppy, know what you mean, we all have those stories. Nothing like listening to a person telling one of the most horrible stories you've ever heard, and because they survived the ordeal they say, "god was with me". Or they're so sick and miserable but say "god is keeping me around for a reason". And if you really want to see god's love watch a child live for only two years and those two years are filled with pain and sickness. Watch the parents pray and suffer. Then when that child dies that same god has taken his angel home because heaven needed another angel. I wish I could find a video link of the Aussie guy bitten by a snake. There should have been no way he survived the bite but he did because things just fell into place the way needed to get him help. He was telling his story and at the last he said, "friends tell me that I only survived because god was with me, so I ask if god was with me why he let the bloody snake bite me in the first place, and since hair has started growing around the bite area why he couldn't have it bite me on me head." He wasn't having any of that "god is good" stuff. I've got to find that video.
quote:
Originally posted by Tomme73:
quote:
Another christian approached me once as I was sitting in my car one morning waiting for my bus to warm up before starting my route.
I didn't know this woman at all. Out of the blue she starts with "Do you have Jesus in your heart?"

I didn't miss a beat and replied with "No, ma'am. He was gettin' kinda heavy. I now have him in the trunk."


Puppy,

Regardless of my beliefs, that was funny! I got all misty-eyed from it. Thanks!
Like the joke that goes something like this: A drunk had a horrible wreck but crawled out unharmed. A passerby that witnessed the accident told the drunk he was unhurt because god was riding with him. The drunk said "then why wasn't he driving"?
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Tomme73:
quote:
Another christian approached me once as I was sitting in my car one morning waiting for my bus to warm up before starting my route.
I didn't know this woman at all. Out of the blue she starts with "Do you have Jesus in your heart?"

I didn't miss a beat and replied with "No, ma'am. He was gettin' kinda heavy. I now have him in the trunk."


Puppy,

Regardless of my beliefs, that was funny! I got all misty-eyed from it. Thanks!
Like the joke that goes something like this: A drunk had a horrible wreck but crawled out unharmed. A passerby that witnessed the accident told the drunk he was unhurt because god was riding with him. The drunk said "then why wasn't he driving"?


HA!!
quote:
what are some of the strange things you've heard a christian say?


"I didn't come from no monkey!"
"Faith is the enemy of reason" ...as if...
"repant!"

Me: "So if things never evolved why do whales have leg bones?" the idiot i was talking to says,
"God must have given them legs so they could get the the ark." think about that. hard. no, this was not bill.


lastly, i was once a member of one of the larger churches here (before they pissed me off and i moved my letter to one of the OTHER largest churches in the area). the choir was a sangin and feeling the groove. a mother was in the choir facing us Congregationalists and her son was on the front pew facing mom.

mom sudden;y started shaking and twittering as if in some sort of convulsion. i started to rise and offer my expertise then i saw her son started doing the same thing there in the pew. they were obviously overcome by the lord's powah and started jumping up and down wildly and in over-obvious joy. the commotion went on for a good 30 seconds - way longer than it had to be - and the chior just kept on. it was waaaaay uncomfortable to those in attendance. we are baptists, after all, not snake handlers . . . this was before i knew there was no difference.

anyway, they both regained their composure before the singing was done.

i heard later that the pastor of the church had a word with them after the service. they were both long-time members of the church but i never saw them again after that. perhaps they were knocked off? i dunno. brother bill was a fine, fine man but you didn't mess with his church. Wink
As bad as anyone could ever have it, no one ever had it worse than Job. Job even questioned God until God let Job in on a couple of things. In the end, Job was rewarded greatly. Was it God who did all those things to Job? No. God allowed Satan to do all those things. Why? Bragging rights? God knew how it would end and knew Satan wouldn't succeed in causing Job to curse his God.
God causes all things to work together for good for those who serve Him. The problem is most people don't even talk to God until they're having problems. If you don't trust God with the little things, how can you expect Him to take care of the big things? Some people don't even think about there being a God until things get tough. Then it's "God? Are you there?" Don't expect Him to follow through if you're not going to follow through.
"How do you know God is real?" I've experienced things in my life that could only be explained by the existence of God. Specifics? I've gone over them before, but here is one example.
I went to work for Baron Services, Inc when I got out of the Navy. Baron Services is a full-service weather company based in Huntsville. We were on a job in Tampa, FL. The radar antenna pedestal had been struck by lightning (again) and we had taken it apart to get to the bottom of things. There are 2 encoder assemblies with 2 encoders each, one for elevation control and one for azimuth control. The encoder assembly had an encoder for coarse alignment and an encoder for fine alignment. If the elevation encoder assembly has to be replaced, there is a specific procedure, written by the manufacturer, that MUST be followed (according to Orbit Technology Group's engineers) in order to properly align their encoders. First, the coarse alignment encoder must be adjusted to 0± 4° before proceeding to the fine encoder alignment. The fine alignment CANNOT be performed UNTIL the coarse alignment is completed. Well, we had attempted the coarse alignment for the better part of an hour to no avail. When all I could do had been exhausted, I said a quick little prayer, "God, please let this adjustment work." The very next test, we turned on the antenna control, the antenna went up, went down, went back up and stopped on EXACTLY 0°! The guy who was with me in the radome was shocked. I told him we needed to contact Orbit and tell them of the new prayer method of coarse encoder alignment. Remember, according to the engineers who designed and manufactured this pedestal, 0° perfect alignment can ONLY be attained by FIRST performing the coarse alignment and THEN performing the fine alignment procedure. Never in the history of Baron Services Radar Department had a replacement encoder EVER gone to 0° without performing the coarse alignment. NEVER! Call it what you will. I call it God.
"Why would God fix your stupid radar, but let a little girl get raped for years by her evil step-dad?" I don't know. I don't have all the answers. Those of you with little to no electronic engineering experience will probably not appreciate my story in the least. That's okay. It's just one of many.
quote:
Originally posted by Unobtanium:
quote:
what are some of the strange things you've heard a christian say?


"I didn't come from no monkey!"
"Faith is the enemy of reason" ...as if...
"repant!"

Me: "So if things never evolved why do whales have leg bones?" the idiot i was talking to says,
"God must have given them legs so they could get the the ark." think about that. hard. no, this was not bill.


lastly, i was once a member of one of the larger churches here (before they pissed me off and i moved my letter to one of the OTHER largest churches in the area). the choir was a sangin and feeling the groove. a mother was in the choir facing us Congregationalists and her son was on the front pew facing mom.

mom sudden;y started shaking and twittering as if in some sort of convulsion. i started to rise and offer my expertise then i saw her son started doing the same thing there in the pew. they were obviously overcome by the lord's powah and started jumping up and down wildly and in over-obvious joy. the commotion went on for a good 30 seconds - way longer than it had to be - and the chior just kept on. it was waaaaay uncomfortable to those in attendance. we are baptists, after all, not snake handlers . . . this was before i knew there was no difference.

anyway, they both regained their composure before the singing was done.

i heard later that the pastor of the church had a word with them after the service. they were both long-time members of the church but i never saw them again after that. perhaps they were knocked off? i dunno. brother bill was a fine, fine man but you didn't mess with his church. Wink


Cherry picking odd instances within a church setting doesn't prove any particular point, you realize that right? See, I don't have anything like that to post about athiests, simply because I don't congregate in a setting where I know I don't believe anything that is being spoken of. You and I are obviously on complete opposite ends of the spectrun in terms of spiritual beliefs, but I would've thought the same thing as you if I would've see that show you spoke of. Once again, you prove nothing with that.
Too me it seems odd that one would call "faith in God" stupid and ignorant, yet right behind that would tell you how they have faith that this all started from nothing and randomly we got to this magical place in time we live now. So faith in God is moronic, but faith in .... nothing is somehow intelligent? If what you believe must also be grounded in faith, I believe you should remove the intellectual pedestal you reside when debating the issue if "faith" is that which you attack the most about the opposing view.
quote:
Originally posted by Tomme73:
As bad as anyone could ever have it, no one ever had it worse than Job. Job even questioned God until God let Job in on a couple of things. In the end, Job was rewarded greatly. Was it God who did all those things to Job? No. God allowed Satan to do all those things. Why? Bragging rights? God knew how it would end and knew Satan wouldn't succeed in causing Job to curse his God.
God causes all things to work together for good for those who serve Him. The problem is most people don't even talk to God until they're having problems. If you don't trust God with the little things, how can you expect Him to take care of the big things? Some people don't even think about there being a God until things get tough. Then it's "God? Are you there?" Don't expect Him to follow through if you're not going to follow through.
"How do you know God is real?" I've experienced things in my life that could only be explained by the existence of God. Specifics? I've gone over them before, but here is one example.
I went to work for Baron Services, Inc when I got out of the Navy. Baron Services is a full-service weather company based in Huntsville. We were on a job in Tampa, FL. The radar antenna pedestal had been struck by lightning (again) and we had taken it apart to get to the bottom of things. There are 2 encoder assemblies with 2 encoders each, one for elevation control and one for azimuth control. The encoder assembly had an encoder for coarse alignment and an encoder for fine alignment. If the elevation encoder assembly has to be replaced, there is a specific procedure, written by the manufacturer, that MUST be followed (according to Orbit Technology Group's engineers) in order to properly align their encoders. First, the coarse alignment encoder must be adjusted to 0± 4° before proceeding to the fine encoder alignment. The fine alignment CANNOT be performed UNTIL the coarse alignment is completed. Well, we had attempted the coarse alignment for the better part of an hour to no avail. When all I could do had been exhausted, I said a quick little prayer, "God, please let this adjustment work." The very next test, we turned on the antenna control, the antenna went up, went down, went back up and stopped on EXACTLY 0°! The guy who was with me in the radome was shocked. I told him we needed to contact Orbit and tell them of the new prayer method of coarse encoder alignment. Remember, according to the engineers who designed and manufactured this pedestal, 0° perfect alignment can ONLY be attained by FIRST performing the coarse alignment and THEN performing the fine alignment procedure. Never in the history of Baron Services Radar Department had a replacement encoder EVER gone to 0° without performing the coarse alignment. NEVER! Call it what you will. I call it God.
"Why would God fix your stupid radar, but let a little girl get raped for years by her evil step-dad?" I don't know. I don't have all the answers. Those of you with little to no electronic engineering experience will probably not appreciate my story in the least. That's okay. It's just one of many.

The way I see it.
That's not god-That's persistence.

Ya play with something long enough, you're either gonna break it or fix it.

Probability comes into play here.

There's ALWAYS more than one way to accomplish s task. The procedure outlined by the manufacturer was just the most reliable and easiest one to follow.

I can rake my front yard with a toothbrush. The rake manufacturer and lawn maintenance companies don't recommend it and it'll take me awhile longer to do it, but the end result will be just as correct.

I can tune my SSB rig using only the RIT fine adjustment instead of getting near the center frequency first with the coarse tuner-it just takes a little longer.

If you raise and lower the power window in your car exactly halfway through it's range of travel a bunch of times, holding the switch on the exact same length of time each cycle-the window will stop in a slightly different place each time. Do it enough times and it'll eventually stop at exactly the halfway point again. All the way closed and all the way open will happen during the cycles required to make it stop where it started again.

Same idea with the antenna motors. Mechanical wear/sticking/binding/ and dirty contacts on controllers will also cause erratic operation. Cycling them corrects some of those problems as well as eventually re-aligning the antenna where you want it. If you'd kept cycling it the same amount of time again-it would've come right back to 0 degrees again.

I don't remember what that phenomena is called, but I've seen it all my life in things mechanical that operate in cycles.

If 'god' works for you, however...More power to ya. Big Grin
See, that Job story. Thats one of the questions I have about that fair and just god all you people rave about. Why would god allow his most loyal subject to be put through all that to prove a point god already knew the answer to? I mean he should have been rewarded from the get go, not tormented then rewarded. cruel god..mean god. If I had a god, he wouldn't treat his "children" like that.
quote:
Originally posted by bluetick:
See, that Job story. Thats one of the questions I have about that fair and just god all you people rave about. Why would god allow his most loyal subject to be put through all that to prove a point god already knew the answer to? I mean he should have been rewarded from the get go, not tormented then rewarded. cruel god..mean god. If I had a god, he wouldn't treat his "children" like that.
God has a mean streak alright.


Genesis 22:1-12
Some time later God tested Abraham. He said to him, "Abraham!"

"Here I am," he replied.

Then God said, "Take your son, your only son, Isaac, whom you love, and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains I will tell you about."

Early the next morning Abraham got up and saddled his donkey. He took with him two of his servants and his son Isaac. When he had cut enough wood for the burnt offering, he set out for the place God had told him about. On the third day Abraham looked up and saw the place in the distance. He said to his servants, "Stay here with the donkey while I and the boy go over there. We will worship and then we will come back to you."

Abraham took the wood for the burnt offering and placed it on his son Isaac, and he himself carried the fire and the knife. As the two of them went on together, Isaac spoke up and said to his father Abraham, "Father?"

"Yes, my son?" Abraham replied.

"The fire and wood are here," Isaac said, "but where is the lamb for the burnt offering?"

Abraham answered, "God himself will provide the lamb for the burnt offering, my son." And the two of them went on together.

When they reached the place God had told him about, Abraham built an altar there and arranged the wood on it. He bound his son Isaac and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood. Then he reached out his hand and took the knife to slay his son. But the angel of the LORD called out to him from heaven, "Abraham! Abraham!"

"Here I am," he replied.

"Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son."
quote:
Originally posted by bluetick:
See, that Job story. Thats one of the questions I have about that fair and just god all you people rave about. Why would god allow his most loyal subject to be put through all that to prove a point god already knew the answer to? I mean he should have been rewarded from the get go, not tormented then rewarded. cruel god..mean god. If I had a god, he wouldn't treat his "children" like that.


Blue, don't be a moran. God did that cause he loved job. Im glad he doesn't live me.
"Most atheists assume that a personal God would only create a universe that is both good morally and perfect physically. However, according to Christianity, the purpose of the universe is not to be morally or physically perfect, but to provide a place where spiritual creatures can choose to love or reject God - to live with Him forever in a new, perfect universe, or reject Him and live apart from Him for eternity. It would not be possible to make this choice in a universe in which all moral choices are restricted to only good choices. One cannot choose between good and bad if bad did not exist. It's an amazing simple logical principle".

Rich Deem
I'm a member of a church in which people frequently "testify" to how God is working in their lives. I've never heard anything as crazy as the lady Jennifer quoted either. To repeat what has been said many times already on this thread, their are fanatics in every group, organization, and belief. It's just unfair to make blanket judgments about people or religious beliefs based on what one person or a few people say or do. I think extremism - in religion and politics - can be dangerous to us all. No doubt about that (and I include extreme atheists in that opinion).

I've sat in services where people were testifying and heard some strange comments too, but I'm of the belief, "to each his own." I hear strange comments when discussing politics, cultures, families, traditions, etc. As an American, I'm just glad to have freedom OF religion and freedom FROM religion. If someone wants a relationship with Jesus my Lord, that's great. If they don't, they have that choice. I just don't spend my time judging people for their beliefs. To each his own.

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